PROTRUSIONS QUESTION

[Mr_D_Mentor]

How about small protrusions like bolt heads etc. that have been allowed in the past. I don't see the exception in the rules this year.

Unless I'm missing something, this means that if we use the kit frame then we have to cut the front and back rails about 1" smaller than 28" to get the axle bolt heads inside the envelope. (for narrow configuration).

[Jon Stratis]

You are correct, there are no exemptions for bolt heads and the like this year.

As guidance, previously, when we had similar width/length limits for the robot those were absolute limits. The robot had to fit in a rigid sizing box, and a bolt sticking over could be enough to keep you out of the box. Back then, it was common guidance to build 1" under in every dimension to ensure you would fit in the box.

The question is, how will this be treated this year? Personally, I would err on the side of caution and build my robot a little undersized. That way you will be guaranteed not to have an issue. And if you do have a bolt head sticking out just a little too far? I find prayer and a chocolate covered gift to the inspector* does wonders


*bribes don't actually work. I would personally accept the chocolate, eat it, then send Al over to perform the inspection

[magnets]

I predict there will be many teams who show up with a kitbot with the bolt heads sticking out this year. FIRST may want to consider a blog post/Update that covers this issue, as I know I'd be really sad if I were a rookie team having to cut up my robot when I got to the competition.

[DonRotolo]

Originally Posted by magnets

I predict there will be many teams who show up with a kitbot with the bolt heads sticking out this year. FIRST may want to consider a blog post/Update that covers this issue, as I know I'd be really sad if I were a rookie team having to cut up my robot when I got to the competition.

Perhaps having to do that will teach them to read the rules next time, eh? Hard lesson, but effective.

As Jon stated (as per Q&A) there are not exceptions for bolt heads and the like.

My advice to teams is to build to 27 x 41 x 77. Will an extra inch really make the robot work any better??

[gpetilli]

Please keep in mind that the transport dimensions are absolute - unlike recent years which were a somewhat subjective perimeter. The allowance for bolt heads has specifically been ruled out (they do count towards the size limit). In the years before the switch to a perimeter rule, they had an inspection box that the robot had to fit in - bolts and all. It was an unbiased pass/fail test. I have seen teams grinding welds and replacing bolts with rivets to get that last 0.1 inch off so that they fit into the box.

Please design your robot to be at least 0.5in smaller than the transport limits to allow for tolerance of assembly and the inspection box.

[dtengineering]

I'd encourage FIRST to consider a scaled up version of the laser sizing box I built for use at our VEX tournaments.

It is brutally effective... and quick. http://www.vexforum.com/showthread.p...t=laser+sizing

But more likely there will be a more traditional sizing box.

Jason

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by dtengineering

I'd encourage FIRST to consider a scaled up version of the laser sizing box I built for use at our VEX tournaments.

It is brutally effective... and quick. http://www.vexforum.com/showthread.p...t=laser+sizing

But more likely there will be a more traditional sizing box.

Jason

When I read "laser sizing box", I imagined a machine that uses lasers to shave off any offending bits of the robot.

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by dtengineering

I'd encourage FIRST to consider a scaled up version of the laser sizing box I built for use at our VEX tournaments.

It is brutally effective... and quick. http://www.vexforum.com/showthread.p...t=laser+sizing

But more likely there will be a more traditional sizing box.

Jason

The current official ruling on how the footprint portion of the sizing will be checked is with a tape outline on the floor. The height will be checked with a tape measure. I can see a plumb bob being used in the case of robots that are in a "mushroom" shape in the transport configuration.

[asid61]

Originally Posted by DonRotolo

Perhaps having to do that will teach them to read the rules next time, eh? Hard lesson, but effective.

As Jon stated (as per Q&A) there are not exceptions for bolt heads and the like.

My advice to teams is to build to 27 x 41 x 77. Will an extra inch really make the robot work any better??

You would be surprised how much an extra inch would have helped us this year. One more inch would have made a pretty drastic change in our robot.

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by magnets

I predict there will be many teams who show up with a kitbot with the bolt heads sticking out this year. FIRST may want to consider a blog post/Update that covers this issue, as I know I'd be really sad if I were a rookie team having to cut up my robot when I got to the competition.

Originally Posted by DonRotolo

Perhaps having to do that will teach them to read the rules next time, eh? Hard lesson, but effective.

As Jon stated (as per Q&A) there are not exceptions for bolt heads and the like.

The first year of the frame perimeter rule, a team showed up with a 38x28 robot. They couldn't compete, because they couldn't reconfigure it within the timeframe of the competition.

To the team's credit, when it was determined hopeless, they helped other teams with lesser problems.

[Jon Stratis]

Originally Posted by GaryVoshol

The first year of the frame perimeter rule, a team showed up with a 38x28 robot. They couldn't compete, because they couldn't reconfigure it within the timeframe of the competition.

To the team's credit, when it was determined hopeless, they helped other teams with lesser problems.

I had two of those, one at each of the events I was LRI. Was caught them quick, have them dedicated inspector help, and managed to get them in the field that weekend. It was very tough, and they did little more than drive around, but it was a valuable learning experience for them!

[kmusa]

Originally Posted by Jon Stratis

There are no game rules specifying max length or width while the robot is on the field.

Except for G7-C:

When placed on the FIELD for a MATCH, each ROBOT must be completely outside of their AUTO ZONE and LANDFILL ZONE.

[kmusa]

Originally Posted by Jon Stratis

I find prayer and a chocolate covered gift to the inspector* does wonders


*bribes don't actually work. I would personally accept the chocolate, eat it, then send Al over to perform the inspection

So how does Al feel about chocolate?