qualifying or eliminations style robots

[mrnoble]

Originally Posted by ttedrow

I have to disagree. A stacked tote set with three robots in auto zone in only worth 24 points and will be very difficult to do. Especially without knocking over the RCs.
Control and stacking the RCs will make the difference for the consistently high scoring teams.

That's not what was meant regarding autonomous.

[staplemonx]

Originally Posted by John Retkowski

Elims are the same game as qualifiers. The only thing removed is coop points.

That being said it doesn't really come down to a change in robots. It comes down to a change in strategy.

In My Opinion

• Stackers will get you into eliminations, they will not be able to win it.
• Stackers plus staging zone auton will get you top 8 seed, but will not guarantee eliminations.
• Stacker plus landfill auton will guarantee you an eliminations win.

[Siri]

Originally Posted by ttedrow

I have to disagree. A stacked tote set with three robots in auto zone in only worth 24 points and will be very difficult to do. Especially without knocking over the RCs.
Control and stacking the RCs will make the difference for the consistently high scoring teams.

Consistently high-scoring yes, but consistently high-scoring =/= competition winning. In fact, that's exactly why blue banners have to be won in auto.

[Kevin Ray]

Originally Posted by dellagd

The question is, "Which one should we design for?" Its a tough one, but this has generally been my reasoning: It's best to control your own destiny, because if not, you're forced to hope that others will control it well for you. And in a competition, that's a very hard decision to justify. As such, you want to rank well to be an alliance captain, and that means you have to perform will in the quals, which means designing for the quals.

I agree completely, with the caveat that you can design for both but emphasize one. Here's how; by designing a 6 stacker and a capper (RB on top) you've ensured that you're relying on no one to complete the stack. However, if you become an alliance capt (and yes, auto is SOOO important) and have the opportunity to select an ally who exclusively manages RB's, (to include pulling them from the step in auto to deny the opposition access) you can now focus on quickly stacking sets of six to be capped by the alliance member.

That being said, one auto bot of penultimate importance at St. Louis will be that RB grabber in auto. The alliance who owns them will win on Einstein!

[Edxu]

Originally Posted by Kevin Ray

That being said, one auto bot of penultimate importance at St. Louis will be that RB grabber in auto. The alliance who owns them will win on Einstein!

Couldn't agree more. I think that the Middle Recycling bins will be the turning point in higher-level elim matches and on the Einstein field. That being said, I think that those types of robots will have issues in Quals matches, due to having to commit to doing the RB grab.

[Dunngeon]

Originally Posted by mrnoble

That's not what was meant regarding autonomous.

Which unfortunately emphasizes NuggetSyl's point perfectly.

[Rangel]

It's a tough decision either way. Focusing on doing well in quals can put you into a picking position but you risk not being able to get a middle recycling container bot unless you are the number 1 robot. On the other hand, even if you are the best middle recycling container bot, there is no guarantee that the best alliances will even pick you. You might be picked by a lower weaker alliance that can't use you as effectively. It's a tradeoff I really like in the game and few teams that do it will probably end up on Einstein.

[John Retkowski]

Originally Posted by staplemonx

In My Opinion

• Stackers will get you into eliminations, they will not be able to win it.
• Stackers plus staging zone auton will get you top 8 seed, but will not guarantee eliminations.
• Stacker plus landfill auton will guarantee you an eliminations win.

All those designs use a Stacker.

I completely agree that the containers in the middle are going to be vital. I'm trying to emphasize the point that the same mechanisms and robots can play differently in elimination matches then they can in qualifiers. This includes autonomous. A robot could have code for a three yellow tote stack when the middle containers may not decide the outcome of a match. Vice Versa, when elimination matches come around and every game piece counts, they could switch to another code to get the containers. I'm not saying I think mastering both is easy, but I do think it's possible.