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Unread 04-02-2015, 11:25
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Re: Best FIRST game...

Best autonomous for me is 2007 (2015 is a close second, but I want to see how it plays out). IMO, that's the last year where FRC's autonomous was harder than VRC & FTC. Every year since then, teams could dead reckon with mere encoder feedback (or nothing) in order to get major points. There has been very little incentive in recent years to attempt the harder auto routines since they give so little extra value (overall field success relative to available resources) for the average team. 2007 required any sensor system that could deal with an inconsistently-located scoring goal using hardware that was difficult to integrate with the sensors which would make the task easier.

Best Champs Teleop: 2014, by far. Alliances that were mature enough capability-wise to play the entire game DID play the entire game. Scores were through the roof and the matches were very intense. Driver practice/skill was as important as strategic decisions, as there were very few catch-up mechanisms built into the game (no end game!). My team really struggled since we couldn't get around a double-team, but the matches were still a lot of fun to coach and we were able to put up some big scores.

For me, best all-around is 2013. It was fun to build, fun to test, and fun to coach. The matches were pretty intense as well, with a good blend of offense, defense, HP interaction and strategic game play.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:02
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Re: Best FIRST game...

Ranking games my years in FIRST (excluding this year):
2013 ULTIMATE ASCENT - Insanely exciting and fun.
2012 REBOUND RUMBLE - Technical issues and the nightmarish Eintsien aside this game was a blast to watch and the endgame was the best FIRST ever had.
2004 FIRST FRENZY: RAISING THE BAR - The best variety of robots I've seen and the robots never looked more athletic. Some of my all time favorite robots came from this year. Autonomous was useless.
2006 AIM HIGH - Fun game with the best autonomous FIRST ever had because it was so important to win it (at least until 25's alliance disproved that on Einstein in the semis)
2010 -BREAKAWAY - Pretty cool game. The endgame was pretty awesome. 469's robot made it a must watch moment.
2014 ARIAL ASSIST- Better game than it gets credit for when you see it played by team that know what they're doing. The penalties ruined alot of it.
2008 OVERDRIVE - Fun game when played well. Unbearable to witness when not.
2003 STACK ATTACK- Two completely different games in one. The main game no one could really play because it was impossible to protect your stacks outside of making a backdoor deal with the other alliance and too many points were given to the brutal king of the hill endgame that made teams ignore the main part of the game and made people be violent to one another.
2007 RACK AND ROLL - The Rack had to be the most destructive field element in the history of FIRST. If you got your robot snagged in it you could waste a good amount of time trying to safely remove your robot from it or risk damaging your robot trying to get out. Teams were very very violent that year as the championship elims shown.
2011 LOGOMOTION - Not a truly bad game but the endgame was so frustrating.
2005 TRIPLE PLAY - Given that my team won our first regional ever playing this game I should love it but it never really clicked with me. I'm not sure why.
2009 LUNACY - It was like watching snails joust. Better to watch on field level than up in the stands.
2002 ZONE ZEAL - The only game that got considerably worse during the elims which was basically a race to the goal and them a couple minutes of tug of war.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:03
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Re: Best FIRST game...

Reserving my comments to the four recent games since I've been involved:

1 - Rebound Rumble - Easy to follow / straight-forward auto / excellent end-game...AND I LIKED THE COOPERTITION BRIDGE! ...There...I said it!

2 - Aerial Assist - Again, fun to watch / exciting matches / Negative: too destructive and match outcomes dependent upon major foul points

3 - Ultimate Ascent - Negatives: Complex from a viewer standpoint / Horrible real-time scoring / End game did not "mesh" well with the rest, and was too difficult to do well

4 - Recycle Rush - Negative: All or Nothing Autonomous means that any unplanned "dead robot" will result in zero points. Only the very best teams will have a potentially "game-changing" auto.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:06
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Re: Best FIRST game...

For me (note that I'm a strategist), it's Aerial Assist, followed closely by Ultimate Ascent. It seems to me that they've been the most exciting when played at a high level; Einstein last year was one of the most unbelievable series of matches I've ever experienced.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:13
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Re: Best FIRST game...

My favorite by far is 2005. It was simple and easy to explain to spectators, and still had a challenge to it. Plus you still had the element of suspense when teams got to 15+ tetras on the center goal. You never knew if you were going to knock the stack down. It was like a giant game of Jenga in the last few seconds.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:19
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Re: Best FIRST game...

Minus the problems with reffing, I'd say Aerial Assist is my clear favorite. After that, Overdrive or Ultimate Ascent.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:31
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Re: Best FIRST game...

2005 - Tough Challenge, good strategy, switch to 3v3
2007 - AMAZING for Strategy
2006 - I really liked the way they did different periods.
2013 - Pyramids!?!?!
2012 - interesting
2010 - Soccer and 469 + 1114 How did that alliance loose!!!?!?!
2014 - Really good set of matches on Einstein
2011 - Best Auto End game was worth way too much points
2008 - So Confusing
2009 - I never really liked bumper cars.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:34
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Re: Best FIRST game...

I guess I'm the only one here that preferred 2010 Breakaway over the rest. I don't mind a little physicality in a game, I think it adds to the excitement for the spectators.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 12:55
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Re: Best FIRST game...

My favorite games have to be the past two years, Ultimate Ascent and Aerial Assist, in that order.
They were both games that were exciting to watch, and had a variety of strategies that could win the game.
I like games where an inferior Alliance can beat a technically superior Alliance by playing the game intelligently, but robot skill still matters.
With that in mind, I prefer games that give the advantage to the offense rather than the defense, and as such my favorite games are as follows:

Ultimate Ascent
Aerial Assist
Breakaway
Rebound Rumble
Aim High
Overdrive
Logomotion
Rack and Roll
Raising the Bar
(Everything else)
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Unread 04-02-2015, 13:06
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Re: Best FIRST game...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Leonard View Post
My favorite games have to be the past two years, Ultimate Ascent and Aerial Assist, in that order.
They were both games that were exciting to watch, and had a variety of strategies that could win the game.
I like games where an inferior Alliance can beat a technically superior Alliance by playing the game intelligently, but robot skill still matters.
With that in mind, I prefer games that give the advantage to the offense rather than the defense, and as such my favorite games are as follows:

Ultimate Ascent
Aerial Assist
Breakaway
Rebound Rumble
Aim High
Overdrive
Logomotion
Rack and Roll
Raising the Bar
(Everything else)
In Aerial Assist, our last match of NYC, we were downed 2 robots, and I was left to drive. Lets just say I might of gotten a little aggressive, but in the end, the score was 108 to 137. Granted, we lost, but 108 by yourself is some kind of feat. Just a little story for you.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 13:17
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Re: Best FIRST game...

I've only been on FIRST for 3 years, so my favorites go as such:

2014 Aerial Assist. Gosh was it fun. When driving you were having fun and able to work with other teams and last minute moves could mean a win or loss for your alliance (I was the operator and in one of my alliance's semi-finals matches I released a truss shot right before the timer went off and it gave us the extra points to win the match... you could say I was excited ).

2015 Recycle Rush. I think this year is going to be a good one. I think that it will be more strategy and selectively choosing alliances. Especially in the playoffs when top seeded alliances will probably go for teams that can do what their robot can't instead of three amazing robots that could do the same exact thing and one being downgraded. I like that your robot almost has to have a specialty to do well. Should be good.

2013 Ultimate Ascent. I don't know, I didn't love this one. It was more of an in the air game than down on the robots' level (shooting frisbees high with no passing or such interaction like Aerial Assist). It is definitely my least favorite so far.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 13:17
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Re: Best FIRST game...

I have participated in every game since 2001, and here are my thoughts on the games that I have observed.

Ultimate Ascent (2013) and Rebound Rumble (2012) were heads and shoulders above the games that came previously (or since). Excellent mix of scoring challenges, a good offense-defense balance, linear scoring, a nice mix of autonomous challenges, fun to watch, AMAZING endgames, some mobility challenges to consider (going under/over obstacles), worthwhile vision challenges, relatively easy to explain. Oh, and relatively open parts utilization rules compared to prior seasons. Some nits to pick (like the Coopertition Bridge aspect in 2012, and the fact that climbing should have been worth more points in 2013), but all around excellent games.

Next I put Aim High (2006). It was a simple high volume shooting game, and the first time the vision challenge was worthwhile.

FIRST Frenzy (2004) was a nightmare to explain, but it was a fantastically intricate challenge with many ways to score and led to highly varied designs.

Triple Play (2005) had an elegantly simple game mechanic (tic tac toe) and was always exciting to watch (though they should have done something different with the endgame).

Breakaway (2010) was a great idea, but would have been executed better with more lenient robot rules regarding ball possession.

Rack N Roll (2007) too often degenerated into a defense-fest, but it was a nice scoring challenge and a really interesting endgame. Would have been better with linear scoring and some sort of mechanism for limiting defense.

Overdrive (2008) was exciting to watch, but a little too simplistic for my liking. Would have been better with an additional game piece or a more heavily emphasized endgame objective.

Aerial Assist (2014) was awesome during Championship eliminations, and painful to watch just about any other time. The rules led to too much referee subjectivity, the autonomous challenge was such that you were better off not to try than to try and fail, and 4 out of 6 robots had no offensive objective at any given time, leading to scrums. I maintain that the game would have been MUCH more interesting if the truss had been only 18" off the ground

Logomotion (2011) remedied the defense balance of 2007, but maybe a little bit too much. The endgame challenge was the worst that FIRST has ever given us, and the scoring system was terrible. The IRI rule changes made the game a little more palatable.

Stack Attack (2003) had the original autonomous mode, and some interesting strategic aspects due to the nontraditional scoring mechanism, but was once again totally broken by having too much defense (and said nontraditional scoring mechanism).

Zone Zeal (2002) was a stump pulling contest.

Lunacy (2009) was like watching children play rugby.

Diabolical Dynamics (2001) is alone at the bottom because without robots interacting, who cares?

(I will not rate Recycle Rush until after the season, but you can probably infer my opinion from my ranking of similar games...)
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Unread 04-02-2015, 13:24
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Re: Best FIRST game...

For me, it's Ultimate Ascent (2013). Nothing else comes close.
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Unread 04-02-2015, 13:31
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Re: Best FIRST game...

1.) Ultimate Ascent
- Huge mix of robot designs and challenges (shooting, climbing, picking up off floor, etc.)
- Very exciting to watch; lots of robot movement and action

2.) Logo Motion
- Minibot challenge was fun to design and work with
- Fun game to watch

3.) Rebound Rumble
- Many different cool robot designs
- Triple balancing was very exciting to watch
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Unread 04-02-2015, 13:42
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Re: Best FIRST game...

I've only done 1 other competition which was Ultimate Ascent in 2013. It was outstanding and changed my outlook on how I was going to plan the rest of my life. So I'd have to say Ultimate Ascent.
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