Fabricated Items same as COTS

[GeeTwo]

Actually, providing fabricated items produced prior to the event and given at the event to another team isn't allowed, as I read the rules. Check out the first paragraph of R17 (emphasis mine):

At an Event, Teams may have access to a static set of FABRICATED ITEMS, not bagged per R14, known as the WITHHOLDING ALLOWANCE, that shall not exceed 30 lbs. to be used to repair and/or upgrade their ROBOT. The WITHHOLDING ALLOWANCE may only be brought into the Venue when the Team initially loads in at the Event. Items made at an Event do not count towards this weight limit.

I'm sure that throttling GP was not the intent, but that's how the rule is written.

And, just to cover the bases, I don't suppose that your sponsor would be willing to make so many of these parts that you could make them available to every team (for a price), rendering these bits actual COTS items?

[cglrcng]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Actually, providing fabricated items produced prior to the event and given at the event to another team isn't allowed, as I read the rules. Check out the first paragraph of R17 (emphasis mine):


I'm sure that throttling GP was not the intent, but that's how the rule is written.

And, just to cover the bases, I don't suppose that your sponsor would be willing to make so many of these parts that you could make them available to every team (for a price), rendering these bits actual COTS items?

Very interesting read and catch....I was reading another thread about something else entirely last night, and without pointing the exact who's or what out here....I thought the same thing (it was about the loaning of a retractable Ball blocker at Championships last year, and they were told to keep it after the event as a gift)...Now, if that was fabricated at that event only from COTS items, it would not count towards either team/robot(s) witholding allowance.

But, if it was fabricated before the event then there could be violations of the rule (unless like mini-bots of the past, there were direct rule exceptions).
________________________
Same reasoning I asked for prior CD input elsewhere in another thread a while back on a "hypothetical plan" to possibly fabricate a pr. or set of community items "at an event by multiple teams in community ownership of a certain clamp on item" to be used by many teams at an event.....I wanted to see if that working around the rule legally would be accepted on a possible basic idea I had for this years game.

[ToddF]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

And, just to cover the bases, I don't suppose that your sponsor would be willing to make so many of these parts that you could make them available to every team (for a price), rendering these bits actual COTS items?

For a part to count as COTS, it must be sourced from a VENDOR (definition in section 4.1) Interestingly, in your example the mentioned sponsor would probably be a legit vendor, while several popular FIRST "vendors" technically are not.

Originally Posted by cglrcng

Very interesting read and catch....I was reading another thread about something else entirely last night, and without pointing the exact who's or what out here....I thought the same thing (it was about the loaning of a retractable Ball blocker at Championships last year, and they were told to keep it after the event as a gift)...Now, if that was fabricated at that event only from COTS items, it would not count towards either team/robot(s) witholding allowance.

Holy Crap! You are absolutely right! We were the loanee in the situation mentioned above. I don't remember how much weight we brought to the Championships, or how much the blocker weighed, but if we had actually used it during a match, we might have been in violation of the withholding allowance. We would have been honor bound to forfeit that match. Thank god we didn't ever get a chance to use it.

[rich2202]

I wish they gave an exception to Fabricated Items to allow long lengths to be cut down to more manageable lengths.

[Thad House]

Originally Posted by rich2202

I wish they gave an exception to Fabricated Items to allow long lengths to be cut down to more manageable lengths.

I've usually seen this be allowed. Since most aluminum stock comes in 20ft lengths, it would be entirely unreasonable to expect teams to not cut it down. In fact, most vendors will cut it down to managable lengths. Fabricated items is defined as "modified partially or completely into the final form in which it will be used on the ROBOT," and I would argue that stock just cut to random lengths is not counted as a fabricated item. If it had holes in specific locations, or was cut to a specific length knowing it was going to be used for a specific purpose, then yes it would be fabricated. However, just random stock would be fine to bring in.

However, if you did things such as paint, sandblast, powdercoat the parts so they looked better, I would see that as not allowed. The only things I would as an inspector allow is cut to a shorter length to make transportation easier, or random holes that are not drilled in specific areas. Anything more then that I would consider fabricated.

[Scott Kozutsky]

The real trick is to mass produce your robot so you don't have to bag it.

[rich2202]

Originally Posted by Scott Kozutsky

The real trick is to mass produce your robot so you don't have to bag it.

And have it cost $400 or less.

[FrankJ]

Originally Posted by rich2202

I wish they gave an exception to Fabricated Items to allow long lengths to be cut down to more manageable lengths.

I don't think any reasonable inspector would quibble on stock cut to manageable lengths for transport. Some of the stock we get comes in 25' sticks. It gets cut in half immediately for storage. I don't think of it as fabricated parts. As long as it was not cut to size for a part.