Throwing Noodles, is it Worth it?

[KosmicKhaos]

So, I've been watching some week one matches and it didn't take me long to realize that throwing noodles is a very viable game strategy. At first many teams (including I) thought the noodles were too flimsy to throw and wont go far, essentially rendering them useless unless you put them in a container, but now I'm seeing noodles actually fly clear to the other side. In many cases teams are scoring far more in noodle points than in anything else. I know my team was originally planing on to not even touch the noodles, but now I'm reconsidering seeing how many teams are scoring big on noodles. What do you guys think.

[GeeTwo]

There are several threads already running about throwing noodles. One thing that I noticed among the posts was that throwing a well-used noodle is not as easy as throwing a fresh one. If you do decide to throw noodles, here are some rules I'd follow:

1. Sort the noodles. Use the more tattered ones to put in RCs, and the firmer ones to throw
2. Wait until less than a minute is left in the match to throw. They mess up driving. While it may be advantageous to mess up the other alliance, the effect is diluted when figuring the value to your alliance because it is not a match but a points tournament. Unless you're very good (95%) at getting in the other field as opposed to yours, you're doing yourself a net disservice by throwing early. Waiting also reduces the amount of time the other alliance has to "process" your noodles.

[Fields]

Geetwo beat me to it, but I completely agree.

[IronicDeadBird]

I would boil it down to do you want more eyes on the field or do you want more potential score.

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by IronicDeadBird

I would boil it down to do you want more eyes on the field or do you want more potential score.

Sorry, too subtle for me. Which is which, and why?

[MaGiC_PiKaChU]

One thing i observed :

The "not so good" human players have a chance of taking away more points than they will give by throwing outside the field... (a foul takes away a lot of points) It might be worth it to start praticing shooting

[MrJohnston]

One thing that caught my attention: At one of the Week Zero events, the pool noodles seemed to be taped at each end and in the middle. This would greatly increase the potential for throwing them. We've spent a lot of time throwing noodles (both new and used) and have come to the conclusion that consistently throwing the noodles will be near impossible.

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by MrJohnston

One thing that caught my attention: At one of the Week Zero events, the pool noodles seemed to be taped at each end and in the middle. This would greatly increase the potential for throwing them. We've spent a lot of time throwing noodles (both new and used) and have come to the conclusion that consistently throwing the noodles will be near impossible.

Yes, this change was made in the updates to eliminate "the noodle agreement", in which each alliance simply dumped its surplus noodles on its own side, scoring four for the other alliance. If you look closely, the tape is color-coded by alliance.

[MrJohnston]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Yes, this change was made in the updates to eliminate "the noodle agreement", in which each alliance simply dumped its surplus noodles on its own side, scoring four for the other alliance. If you look closely, the tape is color-coded by alliance.

Aargh... I didn't read well-enough... I had it in my brain that the noodles would be different colors.... We'll have to tape our practice noodles and see what happens.

[the duderoni]

Some thoughts:

As MaGiC_PiKaChU claimed, throwing noodles and not having them land inside the field does NOT seem to be a foul. G23 states "ROBOTS may not cause TOTES, RECYCLING CONTAINERS, and/or LITTER to completely leave the FIELD." Robots. Not Human Players. There's nothing in the rules about HPs accidentally throwing outside of the field.

Also, even if you're not going to throw them, don't try and restrict other teams from throwing noodles. I can guarantee you that there's a certain technique to throwing noodles that can get noodles the proper distance 95% of the time, with most going exceptionally far.

The tape helps a little bit in keeping the noodle fly straighter, but it's not too much.

We're absolutely going to be throwing at least 3 noodles a match.

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

If you do decide to throw noodles, here are some rules I'd follow:

Originally Posted by the duderoni

Also, even if you're not going to throw them, don't try and restrict other teams from throwing noodles.

Since you repeated the 95% number, I'm inferring that you're directing this comment at my post. For the record, "rules I'd follow" is an indicator of advice, not an imposition of restriction (like I have that power, anyway). I also specified the conditions and reasons on which that advice was based. If the conditions don't apply to you, the advice may not either.

[IronicDeadBird]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Sorry, too subtle for me. Which is which, and why?

In the Finals instead of having someone focused on trying to get those points you could have them doing the math on what array of stacks you need to beat the opposing side. In qualifications you just want the points though. You have two ports for feeder station, and three human players. Might as well have that third player doing something that actively contributes. An extra spotter for a task that involves precision at distances is always helpful.

[I_AM_Clayton]

Could someone possibly post a link to a video or a few of today's practice matches i'm having some trouble finding any.

[the duderoni]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Since you repeated the 95% number, I'm inferring that you're directing this comment at my post. For the record, "rules I'd follow" is an indicator of advice, not an imposition of restriction (like I have that power, anyway). I also specified the conditions and reasons on which that advice was based. If the conditions don't apply to you, the advice may not either.

I can see where there was some confusion. My post wasn't directed at yours, my apologies. I agree with your two rules, where you should definitely throw the less worn and torn noodles and if you are going to to throw them, make sure a good HP can do it. My 95% number was more of my personal success rate during tests.

I might as well comment on your first rule, anyways. I agree that if the opposing alliance is attempting to make a coopertition set/stack, you should hold off on throwing noodles. However, if you wait too long you're not going to be as successful. It's possible you could run out of time to throw them all, and if you're rushing to throw the noodles there's a greater chance (in my experience) that you'll mess up. What I'll probably do is ask the other alliance if they're planning to make the coopertition set/stack. If no, hurl away. If yes, tell them they have a minute after teleop starts before the noodles come flying.

My original comment was kind of more toward MrJohnston in that he thinks consistently throwing noodles will be close to impossible. It's a semi-common idea that I've been seeing on Chief Delphi where teams are claiming that they are going to be actively discouraging their alliance partners from throwing noodles. This isn't a good idea, in my opinion. In the Week 0 event I attended, I saw a pretty big difference in the abilities of the various Human Players. If your alliance has a good HP, it's a great idea to have them throw noodles. If they don't, I think you should hold off.

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by the duderoni

My post wasn't directed at yours, my apologies. I agree with your two rules, where you should definitely throw the less worn and torn noodles and if you are going to to throw them, make sure a good HP can do it. My 95% number was more of my personal success rate during tests.

Accepted, and congratulations - I can only guess that you've got a finger-flip that spins the noodle fast enough to stabilize it.

Originally Posted by the duderoni

if the opposing alliance is attempting to make a coopertition set/stack, you should hold off on throwing noodles.... if they're planning to make the coopertition set/stack.. tell them they have a minute after teleop starts before the noodles come flying.

Another good rule, especially if #2 doesn't apply to you. Risk management - don't put 40 still-likely points at unnecessary risk chasing 12-28 (assuming you're noodlling 3 to 7 RCs).