IR Remote and R51

[lakecat]

We want to use an IR Sensor and a remote to control the robot from the human player station. However, rule R51 states:

All signals must originate from the OPERATOR CONSOLE and be transmitted to the ROBOT via the ARENA Ethernet network.

Would the IR beam from the remote count as a signal, or does the rule only apply to radio signals?

[AGPapa]

"All signals" seems pretty clear to me.

Could you use the IR remote to communicate with your driver station, and then talk to the robot from there?

[Thad House]

Originally Posted by AGPapa

"All signals" seems pretty clear to me.

Could you use the IR remote to communicate with your driver station, and then talk to the robot from there?

R84 Prohibits using wireless communications to and from the driver station as well.

If you want a way to communicate, you can put a camera on the robot on the robot, and track a drivers hands or something they are wearing from the robot itself.

[Ozuru]

Originally Posted by Thad House

R84 Prohibits using wireless communications to and from the driver station as well.

If you want a way to communicate, you can put a camera on the robot on the robot, and track a drivers hands or something they are wearing from the robot itself.

Sounds a lot like Cheesy Vision, something that isn't allowed anymore.

[Thad House]

Originally Posted by Ozuru

Sounds a lot like Cheesy Vision, something that isn't allowed anymore.

Cheesy vision is only disallowed in Auto. it is 100% legal in teleop.

[Ozuru]

Originally Posted by Thad House

Cheesy vision is only disallowed in Auto. it is 100% legal in teleop.

Oh wow, I had thought you were referring to autonomous for some reason. After rereading your posts, I have absolutely no clue why. My bad.

Having the human player wear a brightly colored glove (or even a glove with retroreflective tape?) might fare well.

[magoldsm]

Originally Posted by Thad House

R84 Prohibits using wireless communications to and from the driver station as well.

If you want a way to communicate, you can put a camera on the robot on the robot, and track a drivers hands or something they are wearing from the robot itself.

If there is a camera on the robot, it would received "signals." How would you judge the legality of each of the following (assuming a camera on the robot and we're in Teleop)?

1. Simple hand gestures.

2. Hand gestures using colored gloves to make tracking easier.

3. A set of cards with QR codes on them.

4. A flashlight to make tracking easier.

5. A laser pointer.

6. Manually blinking the flashlight or laser pointer.

7. Automatically blinking the flashlight or laser pointer.

8. An IR "flashlight" as in #4.

9. Manually blinking the IR "flashlight."

10. Automatically blinking the IR "flashlight."


In R51, the focus seems to be on WiFi/BT. I've always assumed this was for the purpose of positive control by the FMS and to avoid interference. Same for R84. Otherwise, all "signals" would be prohibited, including simple hand signals to a robot-mounted camera. Even an automated targeting system not specifically designed to work with a games vision targets could be construed as illegal under the strictest interpretation.

[KosmicKhaos]

The human player is technically allowed to have his own set of controls as long as they're wired. For example, the human player can have a set of joysticks in the human player zone set up and drive the robot to the chute. Two exceptions though, as stated above it has to be wired and you can only do this if you're on alliance station 1 or 3 because controls can only move 1/2 alliance section away. Check the q and a on this last part it was a fairly recent question. As for other flashlights remote IR transmitters would this fall under special equipment rules?

[EricH]

Originally Posted by KosmicKhaos

As for other flashlights remote IR transmitters would this fall under special equipment rules?

It could. However, note that under T21B, non-powered signalling devices are perfectly legal. Items 1-3 in the above list are perfectly fine under T21B. But by the same token, that means that powered signalling devices are not legal.


So, let's break this down slightly differently (because somebody is being picky about their interpretations...).

Signals using the part of the electromagnetic spectrum that is used by wireless communications are specifically banned unless specifically allowed (the FMS signal, basically). Signals using the infrared or ultraviolet parts of the same spectrum run into issues with powered signalling devices.

But signals using the visible part of the electromagnetic spectrum are just fine.

[techhelpbb]

Originally Posted by EricH

Signals using the part of the electromagnetic spectrum that is used by wireless communications are specifically banned unless specifically allowed (the FMS signal, basically). Signals using the infrared or ultraviolet parts of the same spectrum run into issues with powered signalling devices.

But signals using the visible part of the electromagnetic spectrum are just fine.

What about IR spotlights for retroreflective tape?
Also can what about modulated LEDs in the visible spectrum?

[Wetzel]

Originally Posted by KosmicKhaos

The human player is technically allowed to have his own set of controls as long as they're wired. For example, the human player can have a set of joysticks in the human player zone set up and drive the robot to the chute. Two exceptions though, as stated above it has to be wired and you can only do this if you're on alliance station 1 or 3 because controls can only move 1/2 alliance section away. Check the q and a on this last part it was a fairly recent question. As for other flashlights remote IR transmitters would this fall under special equipment rules?

This rule is buried in the tournament section, T6-1 and the accompanying blue box. Question 471 affirms that you can be in the Human Player Station only if you are in Driver Station 1 or 3.

https://frc-qa.usfirst.org/Question/...ance-member-in

Wetzel