New York Districts?

[plnyyanks]

Originally Posted by Dominick Ferone

Back in 2012 and 2013 we experienced quite a few issues. We had to replay 2 or 3 matches and they even had everyone shut down their smart dashboard and disabled cameras if i remember correctly, which hurt many teams.

I was FTAA at the NYC regional this year. I'll tell you that the Javits Center is an absolutely awful wifi environment. The venue has a number of its own networks all over the 5G spectrum, and a massive hall is not conducive to good reception, either. I know this year, we tried to really stay on top of the wifi environment and make sure it was as good as it could be, and I think that's partially responsible for the lack of major field issues.

[Alex2614]

Originally Posted by Dominick Ferone

There is also a possibility of incorporating Pennsylvania.and/or making the whole northeast one big district.
Incorporate MAR, New England,New York, Penn. into s super district which would incorporate Roughly 525 teams.

The plan is for Pennsylvania to go with Ohio, along with West Virginia and possibly western Kentucky. This was the proposal last I heard.

[Jeanne Boyarsky]

Interesting thread. One thing that I didn't see a response to is:

Originally Posted by Sperkowsky

High schools alone there aren't too many but there are huge schools

Townsend haris
Stuyvesent
Brooklyn tech
Are a bunch of high schools with huge facilities with big teams along with being in 3 different bouroughs. ...

These are the selective schools, not the largest schools. Per wikipedia:
Townsend - 1100
Stuyvesant - 3000
Brooklyn tech - 5400

By contrast, these are non-selective (but still excellent) public schools in Queens, New York City. Both have FRC teams - one rookie; one established.
Francis Lewis - 4000
Cardozo - 4000

While Stuyvesant is a large school, it isn't conducive to a FRC event because you need to take an escalator or elevator to get everywhere. There aren't even rooms to have the pits and field on the same floor. By contrast, Francis Lewis is a flat school. They've been running a FTC qualifier which has gone well.

[Bluman56]

Originally Posted by Jeanne Boyarsky

Interesting thread. One thing that I didn't see a response to is:



These are the selective schools, not the largest schools. Per wikipedia:
Townsend - 1100
Stuyvesant - 3000
Brooklyn tech - 5400

By contrast, these are non-selective (but still excellent) public schools in Queens, New York City. Both have FRC teams - one rookie; one established.
Francis Lewis - 4000
Cardozo - 4000

While Stuyvesant is a large school, it isn't conducive to a FRC event because you need to take an escalator or elevator to get everywhere. There aren't even rooms to have the pits and field on the same floor. By contrast, Francis Lewis is a flat school. They've been running a FTC qualifier which has gone well.

Likewise with Brooklyn Tech. The Cafeteria could easily house the pits but thats on the 7th floor while the gym is on the first floor with a single ramp avaliable to get from the gym to the [actual] first floor . Definitely not accessible by any means (especially if trying to maintain a 7 minute match turnaround).

[Sperkowsky]

Originally Posted by Jeanne Boyarsky

Interesting thread. One thing that I didn't see a response to is:



These are the selective schools, not the largest schools. Per wikipedia:
Townsend - 1100
Stuyvesant - 3000
Brooklyn tech - 5400

By contrast, these are non-selective (but still excellent) public schools in Queens, New York City. Both have FRC teams - one rookie; one established.
Francis Lewis - 4000
Cardozo - 4000

While Stuyvesant is a large school, it isn't conducive to a FRC event because you need to take an escalator or elevator to get everywhere. There aren't even rooms to have the pits and field on the same floor. By contrast, Francis Lewis is a flat school. They've been running a FTC qualifier which has gone well.

I wasn't thinking Francis Lewis or Cardoza.. Both would work. In my head i was thinking of the big frc with the big teams

Fl and cardoza have less established teams therefore in my head less likely yo host an event but fl id huge I've been there multiple times (it was my zoned school) ive actually been to all the schools i listed and all the ones you listed so i know my way around them all. I see the issues with brooklyn tech it being so reliant on multi levels.

[Jeanne Boyarsky]

Originally Posted by Sperkowsky

I wasn't thinking Francis Lewis or Cardoza.. Both would work. In my head i was thinking of the big frc with the big teams

Originally Posted by Sperkowsky

Fl and cardoza have less established teams therefore in my head less likely yo host an event

Cardozo was my zoned school. I hardly went to the cafeteria though so I don't remember if it was on the same floor as the gym. They are a rookie team though. Francis Lewis actually didn't have a FRC team this year, so easy to overlook. They did have a bunch of FTC teams. I'm sure there are other schools of this size/shape as well.

My point still stands . That it's not the # of students that determines suitability for an event. Part of that is layout. Part of it is that these schools were never designed for so many students so the facilities aren't the size one expect. Or rather, someone from outside the area might expect.

My worry is that it will be cramped and/or not enough room for teams to sit and watch. I went to a district event in NJ (just to watch.) It was beautiful. The "small" gym was about the size of the Francis Lewis gym. The "large" gym where the matches were held was huge!

[mistersands]

Originally Posted by Jeanne Boyarsky

Interesting thread. One thing that I didn't see a response to is:



These are the selective schools, not the largest schools. Per wikipedia:
Townsend - 1100
Stuyvesant - 3000
Brooklyn tech - 5400

By contrast, these are non-selective (but still excellent) public schools in Queens, New York City. Both have FRC teams - one rookie; one established.
Francis Lewis - 4000
Cardozo - 4000

No love for John Bowne High School?

I am pretty sure I could get an event hosted here. Conveniently located for NYC and Long Island teams, even a decent amount of parking.

In fact, if I had the time and energy, I would be pushing to host an off-season here in the fall.

[pfreivald]

I love the notion that Albany is "centrally located." To most of NYC, anything outside of NYC might as well not exist...and to most of WNY, Albany is pretty much NYC in terms of getting there.

Three hours from Rochester works if you're already in Rochester, but the geography of WNY is such that you often can't "get there from here" in anything approaching a straight line.

-------------

I like the idea of districts for NY, but only if it will decrease our expenses per play, not increase them. We can afford FLR because we don't have to stay overnight.

(And before people say, "well just raise more funds," we are limited to exactly two (2) fundraisers a year by our school, and run the most successful fundraisers of any school group, pulling in about $3K a year. I don't think most people have a good appreciation for just how tiny many of the towns in WNY are--we're not terribly atypical with 650 kids K-12 in a district five times larger (geographically) than Manhattan.)

So, I like the idea. But it concerns me.

[Sperkowsky]

Originally Posted by mistersands

No love for John Bowne High School?

I am pretty sure I could get an event hosted here. Conveniently located for NYC and Long Island teams, even a decent amount of parking.

In fact, if I had the time and energy, I would be pushing to host an off-season here in the fall.

Forgot about John Bowne I've never been inside but from the outside it looks huge

[Alan Anderson]

I don't get it. A lot of what I'm seeing from people on NYC teams seems to be along the lines of "we have unique limitations" without much willingness expressed to either address the limitations or consider alternative approaches. Am I just not "hearing" it right? Is it a "New York" way of saying things that I'm not picking up on?

Originally Posted by pfreivald

To most of NYC, anything outside of NYC might as well not exist...

I would think holding an event outside NYC would be a good thing for people wearing NYC-only blinders, not something to be presented a priori as a problem. (I'd call it expanding their horizons, but I've spent time in NYC, and the concept of a horizon there is often a tricky one.)

(And before people say, "well just raise more funds," we are limited to exactly two (2) fundraisers a year by our school,...)

What is keeping the team's leadership from asking the school to reassess their fundraising policy in view of the specific financial needs of a robotics team? That's even without looking into what "fundraiser" means and whether it would be possible to do an ongoing/open-ended one that satisfies the existing policy.

[Sperkowsky]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

I don't get it. A lot of what I'm seeing from people on NYC teams seems to be along the lines of "we have unique limitations" without much willingness expressed to either address the limitations or consider alternative approaches. Am I just not "hearing" it right? Is it a "New York" way of saying things that I'm not picking up on?



I would think holding an event outside NYC would be a good thing for people wearing NYC-only blinders, not something to be presented a priori as a problem. (I'd call it expanding their horizons, but I've spent time in NYC, and the concept of a horizon there is often a tricky one.)



What is keeping the team's leadership from asking the school to reassess their fundraising policy in view of the specific financial needs of a robotics team? That's even without looking into what "fundraiser" means and whether it would be possible to do an ongoing/open-ended one that satisfies the existing policy.

There may be a little confusion.

Most of the big NYC teams concerns
1.money
2.transportation(parents dont have cars)

Most of the big Long island Teams concerns
1.money
2.travel time

Most of the upstate teams issues
1.travel distance to nyc
2. I don't know what they are doing up there but i haven't heard anyone from upstate say they didn't have enough money to travel

Some of what you are hearing about nyc problems in this thread are broader issues.

Any championships should be where the highest concentration of teams are, not the "central location" of the state.

Side note

Traveling to long island for nyc teams is also very easy with a hop on the subway to the LIRR. Having a dcmp in long island would work too but also give another 45- 1 hour of travel time to upstate people.

[Kevin Leonard]

Originally Posted by Sperkowsky

There may be a little confusion.

Most of the big NYC teams concerns
1.money
2.transportation(parents dont have cars)

Most of the big Long island Teams concerns
1.money
2.travel time

Most of the upstate teams issues
1.travel distance to nyc
2. I don't know what they are doing up there but i haven't heard anyone from upstate say they didn't have enough money to travel

Some of what you are hearing about nyc problems in this thread are broader issues.

Any championships should be where the highest concentration of teams are, not the "central location" of the state.

Side note

Traveling to long island for nyc teams is also very easy with a hop on the subway to the LIRR. Having a dcmp in long island would work too but also give another 45- 1 hour of travel time to upstate people.

There are most certainly teams upstate with similar problems relating to money and travel time.

A championship in NYC would be 6 hours away from teams in Buffalo and Potsdam, while an Albany championship is 5 hours away from the tip of Long Island.

I won't say which is better, but either one is hurting quite a few teams.

And remember, only the top 60 teams or so would travel to the district championship, and they additionally have the choice to decline.

Additionally, public transit connects Rochester to Albany, as well as NYC to Albany in a straight line, whereas going via public transit from Rochester to NYC takes seven hours.

Regardless of the DCMP location, a discussion about this subject in a formal setting needs to occur ASAP.

[Lil' Lavery]

The fact that a portion of team will end up spending more money on travel when they compete in three events than they do currently competing in one event shouldn't be as controversial as it is.

[Zebra_Fact_Man]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

The fact that a portion of team will end up spending more money on travel when they compete in three events than they do currently competing in one event shouldn't be as controversial as it is.

A lot of people seem to forget (or ignore?) that your district events are going to be at either the same places as the regionals currently are or closer than. Yeah, one might be further away, but the other won't be.

And regarding NY DCMP, if FiM can get 102 teams to work in Grand Rapids (NOT Metro-Detroit), surely 40-60 teams in anywhere is doable. (That said, NYC is expensive!)

[pfreivald]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

I would think holding an event outside NYC would be a good thing for people wearing NYC-only blinders, not something to be presented a priori as a problem. (I'd call it expanding their horizons, but I've spent time in NYC, and the concept of a horizon there is often a tricky one.)

I was merely pointing it out, not necessarily as a problem that cannot in some way be surmounted.

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

What is keeping the team's leadership from asking the school to reassess their fundraising policy in view of the specific financial needs of a robotics team? That's even without looking into what "fundraiser" means and whether it would be possible to do an ongoing/open-ended one that satisfies the existing policy.

It would be a mistake to assume that the policy was not put into place for a good and understandable reason; a further mistake to assume that these conversations have not happened for the past decade and will not continue to happen; it would equally be a mistake to assume that just because the team faces a larger fundraising gap this policy is at all likely to change.