Team falling apart-- any advice would be helpful

[hectorcastillo]

If the only real purpose of starting this new team is so that the coach's kid can have a leadership position, then clearly it's being made for the wrong reason. I don't think I've ever even heard of a school having two FRC teams given how expensive it is to run just one team and how much leadership is required to keep them running. I would advise your program to join back into one team and give this kid a co-captain title to make the coach happy even if he doesn't contribute as much as the deserving co-captains do. I know it doesn't seem fair, but you do what you have to do.

I'm not really sure I understand why all of your other coaches went along with this, though. What justifications were given for making this new team? Perhaps you can show that those can be resolved with one team and don't require two.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by hectorcastillo

I don't think I've ever even heard of a school having two FRC teams given how expensive it is to run just one team and how much leadership is required to keep them running.

Martians (494) and More Martians (70) started at different schools and are now at one school, IIRC.

And then there's 216, 244, and 288, also all out of the same MI high school.

And 11 and 193 in Mount Olive, NJ.

340 in NY for a while was running another team--was it 424?

There are also 3-4 schools running a girls-only team and a co-ed/boys-only team.

There are some good reasons to run two FRC teams from one school, and it CAN be done. But the move to do so needs to have the entire team buying in, and the team needs to be sustainable as one team first (and more than sustainable). If someone just randomly decides to start a second team without any buy-in and without checking whether it's actually feasible, then there's a problem and one of the teams will most likely fail. It could take some time to recover from the attempt, too.

[orangemoore]

Originally Posted by EricH

Martians (494) and More Martians (70) started at different schools and are now at one school, IIRC.

And then there's 216, 244, and 288, also all out of the same MI high school.

And 11 and 193 in Mount Olive, NJ.

340 in NY for a while was running another team--was it 424?

There are also 3-4 schools running a girls-only team and a co-ed/boys-only team.

There are some good reasons to run two FRC teams from one school, and it CAN be done. But the move to do so needs to have the entire team buying in, and the team needs to be sustainable as one team first (and more than sustainable). If someone just randomly decides to start a second team without any buy-in and without checking whether it's actually feasible, then there's a problem and one of the teams will most likely fail. It could take some time to recover from the attempt, too.

I believe that 1241 and 1285 are out of the same school as well.

[Paul Copioli]

So below is the link for the 2016 FIRST rules on 1 team breaking into two teams.

http://www.usfirst.org/sites/default...es%20Final.pdf


Case 2 looks like it applies to your situation and, if things are as you describe, FIRST wouldn't even approve this maneuver. I think you should get FIRST involved immediately.

If you PM me we can chat privately as our annual Woodie Flowers Award Winner meeting with DR. Murphy and Woodie is fast approaching I would love to bring this up as a topic. This situation seems counter to all that FIRST is trying to achieve.

In any case, talking to administration and FIRST are both next steps I think you should take.

Paul

[Sperkowsky]

Team 1155 and team 2265 are from the same school in the Bronx. Granted its a specialized high school named "Bronx Science" which is extremely difficult to get into.

[IronicDeadBird]

Wow...
Well you did the right thing and man, just reading this stressed me out. IF ANYONE on your team (mentor or otherwise) reacts to this by trying to intimidate you and trying to get you to keep quiet ignore them. I'm sure administration would be interested in the logic behind all of this.

Man, that last line though...
Minimize the damage, don't take it all on yourself to fix this problem because you have told the right people.
Don't let this damage you or make you lose your cool, relax you did the right thing. You have come to the right place, don't lose sanity over this.

[fargus111111111]

Just from personal experience I can say that the established team will likely come out ahead if you just keep going. A good, well established team takes time, enthusiasm, and resources. I understand that they are taking some of your resources but if you retain more freedom for members and show better results to your sponsors they will stick with you. This mentor that you are having problems with sounds like they will probably be gone when their child graduates anyway, if that is truly the reason for starting the new team. My advice would be to try to do something about it now because it is definitely not good for your team, but do not panic because the situation will likely dissolve itself in a few years. We had a similar situation except they weren't in the same school, just the same town. They did well the first year, then it all went down hill. 2015 looks to have been their last season. When dealing with the other team always remember your gracious professionalism. It always goes a long way toward resolving conflict.

[SoulianPride]

Definitely speak with the administration about this issue - I have heard of an experience similar in my general region to this and both teams involved spoke to the administration (the superintendent at the time) and worked things out in regard to what was and was not allowed. If, by some chance, you can't work it out using administration as a moderator, speak to FIRST about the issue.

[marshall]

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli

So below is the link for the 2016 FIRST rules on 1 team breaking into two teams.

http://www.usfirst.org/sites/default...es%20Final.pdf


Case 2 looks like it applies to your situation and, if things are as you describe, FIRST wouldn't even approve this maneuver. I think you should get FIRST involved immediately.

If you PM me we can chat privately as our annual Woodie Flowers Award Winner meeting with DR. Murphy and Woodie is fast approaching I would love to bring this up as a topic. This situation seems counter to all that FIRST is trying to achieve.

In any case, talking to administration and FIRST are both next steps I think you should take.

Paul

I had no idea that there were rules for this. Thank you!

[scaredutensil2]

Hey all. I'm also a member of this team, and to be honest with you, this is still going on. A lot of bickering has occurred, and we barely have the resources to have one team supported, let alone two. We have a lot of interest, but we don't have enough to form two teams. There are a lot of political reasons for this decision that I personally know about, and are too personal to go into here, but I believe it was a ploy or incredibly ill-informed decision. I don't know if it was done through sheer incompetence or malice, but it has been completed already.

I don't understand what we are supposed to do, we as students are being forced around by this other team who is requiring access to our tools and our materials and our mentors, and it is a strain on our team which was already stretched far too thin last year.

I don't understand why this decision was made and nobody will tell anyone, it seems very shady and it scares me that First allowed this without taking a good hard look at our team last year.

We barely had enough to fund our team last year, and this year it is far more difficult, because we have another organization competing for all the same grants, and as a rookie team they are more appealing and more malleable from sponsorships.

I wish this was different but there seems to be no way to change this.

[snoman]

This didn't work for you?
http://www.usfirst.org/sites/default...es%20Final.pdf
You guys should try to track down your regional rep. From first if you haven't yet.

This is all very sad

[scaredutensil2]

That link doesn't work..

And secondly, according to them, this is a "special accommodation from first" of which they are giving us 0 evidence, and i do not understand how this is all transpiring.

If anyone has any idea what we could possibly do, I would love to know. I feel as if I am being threatened into accomodating this team and providing them resources which have been paid for and earned by our team members.

[scaredutensil]

Wow I was not expecting so much helpful advice. I honestly forgot to check this with everything that has been going on. Thanks to everyone who responded and sorry for not getting back to you guys.

[Mark Sheridan]

Originally Posted by scaredutensil

Wow I was not expecting so much helpful advice. I honestly forgot to check this with everything that has been going on. Thanks to everyone who responded and sorry for not getting back to you guys.

Follow Paul Copioli's advice. This is the best course of action.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by scaredutensil2

That link doesn't work..

And secondly, according to them, this is a "special accommodation from first" of which they are giving us 0 evidence, and i do not understand how this is all transpiring.

If anyone has any idea what we could possibly do, I would love to know. I feel as if I am being threatened into accomodating this team and providing them resources which have been paid for and earned by our team members.

This link should. http://www.usfirst.org/regional-contacts Start going through the page. You should find a couple of contacts pretty quickly.

I doubt it's a special accommodation. Contacting the Regional Director and Senior Mentor (see link) would clear that up.

That being said, if talking to the school administration and the Regional Director doesn't solve the problem, I might suggest the "parents" route--AKA, have parents put pressure on the school (and the RD) to fix the situation. And if that doesn't work, maybe some well-placed media tips (though I'd strongly hesitate to use that route--there's only one thing more devastating to the team and that's the "nuclear option" of the entire team quitting at the same time).