Team falling apart-- any advice would be helpful

[scaredutensil]

I am posting anonymously on behalf of my FRC team.
At the beginning of this school year my FRC team had a change in leadership and our new coach had a very strange agenda. To preface this they are a elementary school art teacher whose child is was on my team. When they took control of the team things immediately began to change, freedoms that we came to expect were lost, application essays to join the team were introduced, and all student leadership positions were dissolved. While these things are troublesome to students on their own, the real kicker came in with the creation of a rookie team. The students were not involved in this decision and were given misinformation about how the teams would interact.
Students, as could be excepted, were outraged at this sudden and seemingly unnecessary change but our coaches assured us that this was a positive. We almost believed them until the news came in that all of our coaches were leaving our team to coach the rookie team. At this point I knew it was bad news. Luckily we found a new coach to fill the void and have limped on for a while. Lately, however a lot of conflict has come up about the new team and its coach, our ex-coach. Firstly, my FRC team was not allowed to get any new members this year and anyone interested in joining had to go onto the rookie team. Also four of our members, including our ex-coaches child, were taken onto the rookie team. They were promised leadership roles on the new team and that's when it started to look like a ploy. My ex-coaches child is an unremarkable student with mediocre skills at best, not someone who could become a team leader or potential dean's list nominee with all the more suitable candidates on my team. Not only was my team left crippled by the lost of people and resources but my ex-coach expects us to spend our time, which we have been trying to rebuild our mentor and sponsor base with, to do stuff for the rookie team. Obviously my ex-coach does not any say in how we run our team but still interjects into everything we do "to stay in the loop". Lately people have left the rookie team and they barely have enough people to stay alive.
Now getting to the last straw that drove me to ask for help. Today I saw that my teams grant and sponsor form had been copied onto the rookie team's google drive(a file sharing system) and that they have copies of our unsubmitted grant applications. It's now is evident to me that the rookie team has been using our info to raise money and to get corporate sponsors. To compound this issue my ex-coach got mad at me for removing them from our google drive, which they were only on because they used to be the coach, and blew off questions I had about the issues.
Honestly this is getting to political and heated and my team can't function when our grants, members, sponsors, mentors, and even coaches are taken and given to preserve a failing attempt to bolster someone's child. Maybe I am overreacting, but my response seems reasonable due to the circumstances. Any ideas about how to minimize the damage would be very helpful. Thanks.

[Christopher149]

May I ask about how big each team is? It sounds like you don't have enough students for two teams. If this is the case, it makes the decision to create the rookie team seem misguided (along with nepotistic).

[EricH]

I think you need to contact the administration. NOW.

If a teacher is creating a new team when the original team is running fine, and then siphoning off everybody from the original team to the point that it's crippled so that the new team can be successful, there is a problem. And the administration is probably the only group that can effectively deal with it.

[Sperkowsky]

PM me and Ill give you my skype and phone number. I have dealt with some similar circumstances and I think I may be able to help.

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by EricH

the administration is probably the only group that can effectively deal with it.

I concur. Make it clear to whomever on the administration that you speak that in a few months, your new head coach has converted one viable (feel free to use stronger words like thriving if they're justified) team into two marginal (or worse, if justified) teams that are competing with each other for sponsors and bleeding members. It is too late to really put Humpty-Dumpty back together again, but something approaching it may yet be your best alternative to go forward. Make your case to whomever the new coach's boss is (it may be a vice principal, principal, head of the athletic department, or someone else depending on how your school is set up), and then be ready to present it again alongside the new head coach's rebuttals. Don't dwell on the nepotism, but focus on the health/viability of the teams. It would probably be best if the nepotism angle was not specifically claimed as a complaint, though you certainly want to present enough evidence for your "judge" to figure it out as a likely motivator. Select a spokesperson who can keep his/her composure even when presented with the most outrageous counter-claims.

[hectorcastillo]

If the only real purpose of starting this new team is so that the coach's kid can have a leadership position, then clearly it's being made for the wrong reason. I don't think I've ever even heard of a school having two FRC teams given how expensive it is to run just one team and how much leadership is required to keep them running. I would advise your program to join back into one team and give this kid a co-captain title to make the coach happy even if he doesn't contribute as much as the deserving co-captains do. I know it doesn't seem fair, but you do what you have to do.

I'm not really sure I understand why all of your other coaches went along with this, though. What justifications were given for making this new team? Perhaps you can show that those can be resolved with one team and don't require two.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by hectorcastillo

I don't think I've ever even heard of a school having two FRC teams given how expensive it is to run just one team and how much leadership is required to keep them running.

Martians (494) and More Martians (70) started at different schools and are now at one school, IIRC.

And then there's 216, 244, and 288, also all out of the same MI high school.

And 11 and 193 in Mount Olive, NJ.

340 in NY for a while was running another team--was it 424?

There are also 3-4 schools running a girls-only team and a co-ed/boys-only team.

There are some good reasons to run two FRC teams from one school, and it CAN be done. But the move to do so needs to have the entire team buying in, and the team needs to be sustainable as one team first (and more than sustainable). If someone just randomly decides to start a second team without any buy-in and without checking whether it's actually feasible, then there's a problem and one of the teams will most likely fail. It could take some time to recover from the attempt, too.

[orangemoore]

Originally Posted by EricH

Martians (494) and More Martians (70) started at different schools and are now at one school, IIRC.

And then there's 216, 244, and 288, also all out of the same MI high school.

And 11 and 193 in Mount Olive, NJ.

340 in NY for a while was running another team--was it 424?

There are also 3-4 schools running a girls-only team and a co-ed/boys-only team.

There are some good reasons to run two FRC teams from one school, and it CAN be done. But the move to do so needs to have the entire team buying in, and the team needs to be sustainable as one team first (and more than sustainable). If someone just randomly decides to start a second team without any buy-in and without checking whether it's actually feasible, then there's a problem and one of the teams will most likely fail. It could take some time to recover from the attempt, too.

I believe that 1241 and 1285 are out of the same school as well.

[Paul Copioli]

So below is the link for the 2016 FIRST rules on 1 team breaking into two teams.

http://www.usfirst.org/sites/default...es%20Final.pdf


Case 2 looks like it applies to your situation and, if things are as you describe, FIRST wouldn't even approve this maneuver. I think you should get FIRST involved immediately.

If you PM me we can chat privately as our annual Woodie Flowers Award Winner meeting with DR. Murphy and Woodie is fast approaching I would love to bring this up as a topic. This situation seems counter to all that FIRST is trying to achieve.

In any case, talking to administration and FIRST are both next steps I think you should take.

Paul

[Sperkowsky]

Team 1155 and team 2265 are from the same school in the Bronx. Granted its a specialized high school named "Bronx Science" which is extremely difficult to get into.

[IronicDeadBird]

Wow...
Well you did the right thing and man, just reading this stressed me out. IF ANYONE on your team (mentor or otherwise) reacts to this by trying to intimidate you and trying to get you to keep quiet ignore them. I'm sure administration would be interested in the logic behind all of this.

Man, that last line though...
Minimize the damage, don't take it all on yourself to fix this problem because you have told the right people.
Don't let this damage you or make you lose your cool, relax you did the right thing. You have come to the right place, don't lose sanity over this.

[fargus111111111]

Just from personal experience I can say that the established team will likely come out ahead if you just keep going. A good, well established team takes time, enthusiasm, and resources. I understand that they are taking some of your resources but if you retain more freedom for members and show better results to your sponsors they will stick with you. This mentor that you are having problems with sounds like they will probably be gone when their child graduates anyway, if that is truly the reason for starting the new team. My advice would be to try to do something about it now because it is definitely not good for your team, but do not panic because the situation will likely dissolve itself in a few years. We had a similar situation except they weren't in the same school, just the same town. They did well the first year, then it all went down hill. 2015 looks to have been their last season. When dealing with the other team always remember your gracious professionalism. It always goes a long way toward resolving conflict.

[SoulianPride]

Definitely speak with the administration about this issue - I have heard of an experience similar in my general region to this and both teams involved spoke to the administration (the superintendent at the time) and worked things out in regard to what was and was not allowed. If, by some chance, you can't work it out using administration as a moderator, speak to FIRST about the issue.

[marshall]

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli

So below is the link for the 2016 FIRST rules on 1 team breaking into two teams.

http://www.usfirst.org/sites/default...es%20Final.pdf


Case 2 looks like it applies to your situation and, if things are as you describe, FIRST wouldn't even approve this maneuver. I think you should get FIRST involved immediately.

If you PM me we can chat privately as our annual Woodie Flowers Award Winner meeting with DR. Murphy and Woodie is fast approaching I would love to bring this up as a topic. This situation seems counter to all that FIRST is trying to achieve.

In any case, talking to administration and FIRST are both next steps I think you should take.

Paul

I had no idea that there were rules for this. Thank you!

[scaredutensil2]

Hey all. I'm also a member of this team, and to be honest with you, this is still going on. A lot of bickering has occurred, and we barely have the resources to have one team supported, let alone two. We have a lot of interest, but we don't have enough to form two teams. There are a lot of political reasons for this decision that I personally know about, and are too personal to go into here, but I believe it was a ploy or incredibly ill-informed decision. I don't know if it was done through sheer incompetence or malice, but it has been completed already.

I don't understand what we are supposed to do, we as students are being forced around by this other team who is requiring access to our tools and our materials and our mentors, and it is a strain on our team which was already stretched far too thin last year.

I don't understand why this decision was made and nobody will tell anyone, it seems very shady and it scares me that First allowed this without taking a good hard look at our team last year.

We barely had enough to fund our team last year, and this year it is far more difficult, because we have another organization competing for all the same grants, and as a rookie team they are more appealing and more malleable from sponsorships.

I wish this was different but there seems to be no way to change this.