FRC Blog - Something New - Team 'Standards'

[James1902]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

Am I the only one thinking about how many pieces of electronics you could pack into this thing? Without any limits, I could envision some neat applications, some of which possibly could be used to enhance the robot's on-field performance. I think smarter teams are going to find a way to utilize this "extra thing you can put on the field" to their strategic advantage in the game.

From the Full Team Standards specs document linked at the bottom of the blog: "Standards may not be designed such that they blind or distract field
crew, opponent drivers, or audience members. During a match, the Standard must be fixed, physically and visually
(i.e. no strobing, flashing, etc.)."

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by EricLeifermann

While trumpeting you can also have your crier shout ROBOT!!!

Or to be more temporally correct:

Originally Posted by crier

Oyez! Oyez! Oyez!
Robot!

(In case anyone hasn't figured it out by now, I was a member of the SCA (Scociety for Creative Anachronism) for a year or two about three decades ago; I'm loving this theme.)

Oh, and what about a bonus for teams which can properly describe their banners in heraldic language?

Gules, a tiger rampant, surmounting a sprocket of nine teeth argent..

[pwnageNick]

Originally Posted by XaulZan11

This was one of my first thoughts as well (after thinking about costumes for drive teams, refs, field reset...). At least those complaining about them have another avenue attempt to gain a competitive advantage.

I'd be amazed if they don't ban this. I imagine they'll have an update that it can only be purely decorative.

I think giving teams a better opportunity to brand themselves in the area of the field your average spectator would look for your team is great. However, the odds that many teams don't make very quality/professional looking ones will give it somewhat of a school project kind of feel. Add the theme part of it being like a medieval banner and it could turn prospective high school students interested in the program away.

As far as those saying if you don't like it, don't do it; that just doesn't make sense. Good teams aren't going to want to miss out on branding their team and standing out for having a better looking more professional banner.

I think a better idea especially in years to come would be to have a sign area that can be at the top of your drive station glass that can have your name and logo, similar looking to an end zone in football, etc. Simpler, and it could even be a standardized template that FIRST so that the quality of them from team to team doesn't differ much.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by XaulZan11

This was one of my first thoughts as well (after thinking about costumes for drive teams, refs, field reset...). At least those complaining about them have another avenue attempt to gain a competitive advantage.

I would be a little bit careful with electronics, etc. There are requirements, and the field staff are allowed to enforce them. Here are some of the relevant ones:

-- <3lb total weight (and that includes the supports).
-- <3" thick (not a big deal, for most electronics).
-- Flexible material (the banner portion, that is)--wires flex, though.
-- And the big one: during matches, it must be fixed physically and visually. (There's also the standard "no distracting opponents" language, but that's kind of a side thing.) What I would take that to mean would be that if there was a flashing light, or a color changing light, particularly if it was distracting, the field staff would have a friendly chat after the match. (Though there's nothing about BETWEEN matches, displaying while not in a match, and any time not in a match. Important note.)


That being said, if you can do electronics within the requirements (er, "standard standards" ), why not?

[John Retkowski]

Personally, my mind filled with negative thoughts when I started reading the blogs post, but at the mention of badges and other symbols given at competitions, I'm optimistic.


As for the theme...

All this complaining about the theme is pointless.

Kickoff will still come, robots will still be built, matches will still be played, a few champions will still be crowned, and a bunch of students will still get inspired.

All this will happen with a medieval theme this year. Get over it.

Originally Posted by Hallry

To echo this, we are almost done surviving a theme about recycling. And even so, students were still inspired.

I don't know about you, but I'd take a theme involving knights and castles over one involving litter and garbage cans any day.

Why don't we just make the theme of a robotics competition





...a robotics competition?

[GeeTwo]

Did I mention that I'm loving this theme?

[EDesbiens]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Did I mention that I'm loving this theme?

No you didn't

I think we need to look at this in another way... We should talk about the fact that this will straighten teams branding and that it will help anyone watching the matches to figure out which team is which (A lot of people don't know the team numbers at a competition... It can help to see a logo above the team number and to be able to match it with a robot...).

[RyanCahoon]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

Am I the only one thinking about how many pieces of electronics you could pack into this thing? Without any limits, I could envision some neat applications, some of which possibly could be used to enhance the robot's on-field performance. I think smarter teams are going to find a way to utilize this "extra thing you can put on the field" to their strategic advantage in the game.

That was my first thought. A couple people pointed out last year that it was technically legal for the operator interface to extend above the driver station glass, and there were a few scattered discussion about mounting a camera up there for increased visibility.

Alternately, while they can't have retroreflective tape, there's many ways these could be used for vision targets. This could be a feasible way to make a full-field positioning system like [faust1706] and other have been talking about for a couple of years now. Make two banners and give them to your alliance partners in stations 1 and 3, then mount a camera on top of your robot. Unless we have another stacking game or some serious field element clutter, pretty good visibility could be maintained.

[Sperkowsky]

Id say there is a 80% chance they are going to say it has to be decorative. There is always a gray area with this sort of stuff no matter what regulations FIRST sets forth.

[EDesbiens]

Originally Posted by RyanCahoon

That was my first thought. A couple people pointed out last year that it was technically legal for the operator interface to extend above the driver station glass, and there were a few scattered discussion about mounting a camera up there for increased visibility.

Alternately, while they can't have retroreflective tape, there's many ways these could be used for vision targets. This could be a feasible way to make a full-field positioning system like [faust1706] and other have been talking about for a couple of years now. Make two banners and give them to your alliance partners in stations 1 and 3, then mount a camera on top of your robot. Unless we have another stacking game or some serious field element clutter, pretty good visibility could be maintained.

Very true... But, about the electronics part, correct me if I'm wrong but, there is a specific "box" that contains the standard... It can get bigger than that... If you add electronics, you won't be allowed to wire it to your driver station...

[EricH]

Originally Posted by EDesbiens

Very true... But, about the electronics part, correct me if I'm wrong but, there is a specific "box" that contains the standard... It can'tget bigger than that... If you add electronics, you won't be allowed to wire it to your driver station...

Consider yourself corrected...

I'd be inclined to agree: no bigger than allowed--that means some batteries in there to power everything, and batteries aren't the lightest things in the world as a general rule.


Though I do agree on the use of standards as vision targets. As currently written, there is nothing that would prohibit that (though Ryan's suggestion of giving partners standards is probably going to be pushing it; after last year's cheesecake epidemic, I would expect a mild rules/interpretations tightening). I wouldn't be surprised to see some teams with several variations of standards...

[EDesbiens]

Originally Posted by EricH

Consider yourself corrected...

I shal naver b corectedd

I think that they'll soon add a rule saying : "You can only use a standard representing your team"...

[Refresh]

Originally Posted by Justin Montois

No game elements above the driver stations this year.

Or, maybe the standards are part of the game element, we now have our flags for capture the flag?

[EDesbiens]

Originally Posted by Refresh

Or, maybe the standards are part of the game element, we now have our flags for capture the flag?

It is clearly written in the official post that the flags are not part of the game in any way...

[Whippet]

Originally Posted by Refresh

Or, maybe the standards are part of the game element, we now have our flags for capture the flag?

Originally Posted by FRC Blog

The Team Standard is completely optional. There is no element of FIRST STRONGHOLD you won’t be able to play if you don’t create a standard. There will simply be an empty spot over your player station during your matches where your standard would have been displayed.

Probably not. Capture the Flag isn't all that fun when there aren't any flags.

Edit: Ninja'd...