New Track Option

[TankChain]

Originally Posted by arc25565

This track looks very interesting, the only concern I have is the turning speed of the robot. One other question, how much force can the tread withstand before it breaks.

Good questions. Like all designs, tracks have trade offs. Turning is not the strongest part of track designs. However, the design of the treads profile has a lot to do with how the tracks perform in different situations. The taper on the side of the tread profile helps a lot with turning.

Roller chain is defined by ANSI standards. The working load for ANSI #35 roller chain is 480 pounds and the minimum tensile strength is 1760 pounds. Each section of track has two sets of chain on them. These are for standard chain and we obviously are using a modified version. But these are the most applicable numbers I have. We have not done any failure testing yet (it is on the long list). But I designed this to be a serious product and not a toy. Having a steel chain on booth sides of the track and two steel pins running through each tread mean these things take a lot to break.

Josh

[mrnoble]

Originally Posted by TankChain

Are typical turn around time is 2 weeks, but we shoot for shipping as close to 1 week as we can.

If you order black track, and let us know you would like to cancel your order before we ship no restocking fee would apply. If we already shipped it, you would have to pay for the shipping.

Josh

I just sent you a message through your website. Please contact me so we can begin setting up a purchase. Thanks again for all your responses, I think you earned a customer!

[TankChain]

Originally Posted by mrnoble

I just sent you a message through your website. Please contact me so we can begin setting up a purchase. Thanks again for all your responses, I think you earned a customer!

Send you an email. I really appreciate all the questions. I spent a year designing this product because I could not find a solution for my own robotics projects. I released to market in November and have growing ever since. We just want to offer a quality product to people and grow our company to offer more products. I will try to answer any questions you have. The way I see it, this is a chance to let thousands of people review my design. (A little stressful to be honest). How am I doing?

Josh

[mrnoble]

So far, great. I would not have considered your product at all if a), you hadn't posted here, and b), you hadn't been so responsive to questions. Trying a new product from a new company in build season is very risky for teams, and I appreciate that you can give us a chance to test without potentially ruining a build season if things go awry.

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by Tom Line

If you have the entire tread in contact with the carpet at once..... you probably aren't turning very well. That's a drivetrain design problem, not a tread one. I'd expect you want a drop center on this the same as a 6 wheel drivetrain - if not potentially more.

To build upon this point, it's pretty easy to vary your drops/tread profile by adjusting your pulley size. Since the torque is transmitted via the tread, you (likely) don't particularly care about the axle rotation speed. This allows you to use different size pulleys (sprockets, in this case). If all your axles are mounted at the same distance from the bottom of your frame, a larger pulley in the middle would result in a "drop center" in your tread.

[arc25565]

Thank you for responding so quickly to all of our questions. If our team doesn't use this product for the competition this year i would love to use it in an off season project.

[howdosheeplamp]

This looks illegal - there is a rule against studs or anything can/could damage the carpet. Check out R6 in the game manual.

[mrnoble]

Originally Posted by howdosheeplamp

This looks illegal - there is a rule against studs or anything can/could damage the carpet. Check out R6 in the game manual.

Urethane is illegal? Wut

[cglrcng]

Nothing there that could damage the carpet, and I have used more tape on the field carpet than most the past few years repairing it.

If anything else the height of using that chain type tank tread (because each link is separate), will raise the belly pans and the most carpet damaging items (protrusions sticking down from/on the bottom of robot belly pans toward the carpet), up off the floor and away from the carpet further creating ground clearance and if used properly like designed as a tank type sprockets 2 high 2 low w/ a center slightly dropped idler wheel too, leave a much smaller footprint on the carpet so you can actually steer the thing easily.

I hope he can tool up for quicker delivery...I personally want to use it on a Non-FRC outdoor bot or 7 myself.

[amesmich]

Does this not invoke the $400 max part value just because you buy the links separate? One whole track could easily be more than $400.

[MrBasse]

With a two week turnaround, wouldn't this tread have to be considered a fabricated item and any spare tread pieces would then be required to be included in your withholding?

From page 4 of the robot section of the manual (emphasis mine):

D. should maintain sufficient stock or production capability to fill Teams’ orders within a reasonable period during the season (less than 1 week). (Note that this criterion may not apply to custom-built items from a source that is both a VENDOR and a fabricator. For example, a VENDOR may sell flexible belting that the Team wishes to procure to use as treads on their drive system. The VENDOR cuts the belting to a custom length from standard shelf stock that is typically available, welds it into a loop to make a tread, and ships it to a Team. The fabrication of the tread takes the VENDOR two weeks. This would be considered a FABRICATED ITEM, and the two weeks ship time is acceptable.) Alternately, the Team may decide to fabricate the treads themselves. To satisfy this criterion, the VENDOR would just have to ship a length of belting from shelf stock (i.e. a COTS item) to the Team within five business days and leave the welding of the cuts to the Team.)

[TankChain]

Hello everyone,

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone. We have been swamped with emails, calls and orders. I am working on a few things that I hope will help everyone. We have ordered more raw materials so that we wont run short of raw parts.

Our very first order was actually a FIRST team and I talked with them today and they said they would send me some video of their robot and even try to make a video talking about how they went about combining the track with the FIRST kit they started with. I am amazed with them! They might even have some competition video. But I cant promise anything.

We also are working with our injection molding company to scale up fast and get bulk order made in 3 weeks. I am not sure it is possible, but I am working on the details and hope to know specifics in the next 48 hours. They could make 10,000 parts which would be a lot of kits.

We are also working with teams to provide sprockets. We are partnered with USA Roller Chain and we get a distributor rate which we can pass on to you. Our sprockets are typically about half the price of others.

Also, while it will not help this competition, we are planning a survey / questionnaire about what products to add. Would you like to see smaller track for a #25 chain, or maybe larger track for #40? What about different widths of track? Different tread profiles?

And lastly, we are planning a contest for the design of the track assembly. We have wanted to offer a more complete track assembly with tensions, boogie wheels. We encourage teams that use our track to submit the design of how they used it to us. We will pick wining deigns which we will have fabricated and offered as complete kits. There will be prizes and thank you gifts to all who enter. I am just not sure what yet.

Thank you all for the warm welcome. I have wanted to get involved with FIRST and as we grow I hope we can sponsor a few teams down the road.

As always I am happy to answer questions and help in anyway I can.
Josh

[abigailthefox]

Originally Posted by amesmich

Does this not invoke the $400 max part value just because you buy the links separate? One whole track could easily be more than $400.

Technically, I would think that it does invoke the max part value, because parts that are essential to one another are considered one item (i.e. if you buy something made of multiple parts, but that won't function correctly without all the parts, than the parts are lumped together when considering the cost of the item). That does make this a little concerning, because teams could easily require more than 10 feet of tread for their robot. Although, if you form the tread into 2+ separate treads (for each side of the robot, etc.) those could potentially be considered two separate items...with a quantity of 2 on the BOM.

Another concerning point is the manufacturing/ship time...3 weeks during build season? Even if you cut it to two or a little under, that's still 1/3 of the entire build season, and you have to account for the fact that once it arrives, assembly, testing, and possible repairs are still in order...and that's all on the technical side of things.

[NShep98]

Originally Posted by abigailthefox

Technically, I would think that it does invoke the max part value, because parts that are essential to one another are considered one item (i.e. if you buy something made of multiple parts, but that won't function correctly without all the parts, than the parts are lumped together when considering the cost of the item). That does make this a little concerning, because teams could easily require more than 10 feet of tread for their robot. Although, if you form the tread into 2+ separate treads (for each side of the robot, etc.) those could potentially be considered two separate items...with a quantity of 2 on the BOM.

Another concerning point is the manufacturing/ship time...3 weeks during build season? Even if you cut it to two or a little under, that's still 1/3 of the entire build season, and you have to account for the fact that once it arrives, assembly, testing, and possible repairs are still in order...and that's all on the technical side of things.

My understanding, being the one who wrote the BOM for my team last year, is that since the treads are sold by the foot, you would apply the listed price for a single foot, since you do not HAVE to use each foot segment together.

[TankChain]

Hello everyone,

We are getting a bulk run of parts made which should start coming out of the mold Feb 1st. Thank you all for the comments and questions. I made a new thread specific to the bulk order. You can see it here.

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=141621

Any questions please let me know,

Joshua Updyke
Director of Robotics | Tank Chain Robotics
http://www.tankchain.com