Team Update 2 (2016)

[Hallry]

https://firstfrc.blob.core.windows.n...Updates/02.pdf

[IndySam]

Really disappointed they didn't fix G18 for climbing. This task is going to be very hard.

Looks like getting off a couple extra shots and challenging may be the way to go.

[SenorZ]

If it were easy it wouldn't be worth triple the points, right?

We've been trying to come up with ideas that allow for shorter robots that will have a low potential of violating this rule. It is challenging.

[Kevin Sevcik]

I'm confused about the complaint of extreme difficulty. Ri3D 1.0 looks like they've built a legal mechanism, or one that could very easily be made legal with a bit of frame extension on the front. It doesn't seem all that complicated for a tall robot, really. Now is it complicated for a short robot? Yes. But I suspect the GDC wanted to encourage a bit of innovation and effort beyond just copying tape measures from 2010.

[Jarren Harkema]

The updates to G25 and G40-1 Really nerfed some of the innovative strategy ideas. I guess they really want us to play this game as it was intended.

My question regarding G28 is this: If you can't contact an opponent in your courtyard, regardless of who initiates contact, how does G11 apply? It seems that G28 takes precedence, which means an opposing robot can cause the other alliance to foul without recourse.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Jarren Harkema

My question regarding G28 is this: If you can't contact an opponent in your courtyard, regardless of who initiates contact, how does G11 apply? It seems that G28 takes precedence, which means an opposing robot can cause the other alliance to foul without recourse.

If they aren't even trying to hang, then I think I could make a pretty good case to call for G11. Or, to be even more obvious, if they're chasing you around trying to make contact, and G11 isn't called, it might be time to have a chat with the Head Referee.

[PayneTrain]

Originally Posted by Jarren Harkema

The updates to G25 and G40-1 Really nerfed some of the innovative strategy ideas. I guess they really want us to play this game as it was intended.

My question regarding G28 is this: If you can't contact an opponent in your courtyard, regardless of who initiates contact, how does G11 apply? It seems that G28 takes precedence, which means an opposing robot can cause the other alliance to foul without recourse.

RE: updates to G25 and G40, I think the last time anyone played chicken with the GDC and won was 469 in 2010. These rule changes were coming.

RE: G28, I assume that is the case, but that is something that a Q&A could help codify. They don't want a robot blocking a challenge or scale, they want that robot challenging/scaling. Very 2011-esque rule, but that's probably how it works.

EDIT: Eric has a better handle on it... if that kind oif action he mentioned is repeated, it probably even ventures into a T6. The GDC doesn't want robots intentionally ignoring the opportunity to challenge by either screening up robots in the courtyard or chasing each other in the box.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by Jarren Harkema

I guess they really want us to play this game as it was intended.

Originally Posted by Jarren Harkema

My question regarding G28 is this: If you can't contact an opponent in your courtyard, regardless of who initiates contact, how does G11 apply? It seems that G28 takes precedence, which means an opposing robot can cause the other alliance to foul without recourse.

The G11 blue box seems to make that pretty clear. It's a G28 penalty unless the team that would benefit from the G28 is clearly only trying to draw a penalty and not try to, say, CHALLENGE or SCALE or score a boulder.

[Jarren Harkema]

Good points all, thanks for clarifying. Wil and Kevin, I probably should have thrown a bit of sarcasm behind my statement, I figured these two areas were going to get fixed, it's just interesting to see how they resolved it.

[New Lightning]

I get that the GDC wants robots to play the game and challenge the tower themselves; however, I feel like it stifles late qualification round strategies of trying to limit your opponents getting additional ranking points and potentially overtaking you in the rankings. For example if your up on a team in the opposing alliance by 3 RP's. Your opponent is winning the game by more points than you could possibly score by trying to challenge yourself and their tower isn't weakened so no extra RP for you. It would make more since to try and deny your opponent the extra RP from capturing your tower rather than uselessly gaining game points for yourself.

[Dan Petrovic]

Can someone explain the update to G25 a bit better for me? Any extensions from outside the Secret Passage that can block multiple openings would be longer than 15" and blocking both openings from inside the Secret Passage puts you at a huge risk for a Technical Foul. I don't see how this new rule changes anything.

[Leav]

Originally Posted by Dan Petrovic

Can someone explain the update to G25 a bit better for me? Any extensions from outside the Secret Passage that can block multiple openings would be longer than 15" and blocking both openings from inside the Secret Passage puts you at a huge risk for a Technical Foul. I don't see how this new rule changes anything.

There were discussion on having a robot stand outside the secret passage and block the openings in order to control the game (see discussion here).

There are still ways to make that concept work, but they just got a lot less likely to succeed.

[GeeTwo]

How do you post a question to the Q&A? I created an account on Thursday, got the e-mail, verified, saw a web page that said I had full access, and logged in, but I can't find any place to ask a new question. Is the control hidden somewhere in plain sight?

• The Q&A tab looks the same as before
• The Team Questions tab says "Your request is in pending state"
• The My Account tab says
  • Account Information (with info)
  • Change Password (with blocks for that)
  • User Settings (with two check boxes)
  • Questions I'm Following (with an empty table, as I have not followed any questions)

[RufflesRidge]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

How do you post a question to the Q&A? I created an account on Thursday...

You use the account info in TIMS, don't create one with your personal info. Personal accounts basically let you follow questions and that's about it.

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by RufflesRidge

You use the account info in TIMS, don't create one with your personal info. Personal accounts basically let you follow questions and that's about it.

Thanks. I just thought they were anonymizing the names of those posting questions. Can any of the mentors/contacts associated with a team get this from TIMS, or just the primary and alternate? I don't see where the password would be.