A little bitter...

[Matt Leese]

My thought is that FIRST has set up nationals in a way that eventually there will be no "open" spots (you have to qualify in some way). I basically think that over the course of several years we'll see fewer and fewer of the "open" spots available as they get filled up by the increasing number of teams that are able to attend by qualification. The whole point of doing this long term is so that FIRST doesn't have to deal with the numbers of people who will complain that they don't get to go without qualifying (there get enough complaints over how it's setup this year). So I think eventually everyone will have to qualify but I'd love to see FIRST implement something to even the ability to qualify for teams based on the number of events you attend.

Matt

[s_alaniz]

WHOA! Jordan!
NOT ANOTHER REGIONAL!!! Sorry, as a regional co-ordinator, I'm surprized we have 17 this year! And that groan you heard was the blurry eyed folks of FIRST and Deka who travel during the competition period helping run the regionals rolling over to take a good look at you so they know who to blame when regional 18 becomes a reality...
But overall you make a great point.



Best Wishes

Steve Alaniz


"Ted, the microwave just exploded your soup..." - Sally Forth
" Once again, technology turns on it's masters." - Ted Forth

[Jessica Boucher]

Driving to robot-related activities is awesome! Ive done it multiple times and probably one year (once I get a car and the courage to drive on the highway again), I'll be driving myself to Nationals. But for now, its the airways for me...

And my take on adding regionals...there are many people that are willing to help FIRST out by volunteering their time (I do it willingly over and over just to keep involved in the project)...FIRST just needs to ask around.

[Robby O]

Alright! How far has my driving-to-kickoff-from-florida gotten? Cause as far as I know, Only the peeps I was with and talked to at kickoff knew. But I do have to relay that story some time... It was, um, interesting. Especially on that 18 hour straight drive from connecticut, to jacksonville FL. By the last two I thought I was a hummingbird... (guess the toon I stole that from=^)

Oh, and I also thought It would be cool to do the drive up again next year and to other events, but to actually arrange to rent SUV's or vans or borrow them from people who own, and have 4 to a vehicle FIRST tailgate party, wagon train kinda things. Thoughts on that???

-Robby O
FIRSTanimators Moderator
oshortwan@hotmail.com

[EddieMcD]

Originally posted by Matt Leese
My thought is that FIRST has set up nationals in a way that eventually there will be no "open" spots (you have to qualify in some way). I basically think that over the course of several years we'll see fewer and fewer of the "open" spots available as they get filled up by the increasing number of teams that are able to attend by qualification. The whole point of doing this long term is so that FIRST doesn't have to deal with the numbers of people who will complain that they don't get to go without qualifying (there get enough complaints over how it's setup this year). So I think eventually everyone will have to qualify but I'd love to see FIRST implement something to even the ability to qualify for teams based on the number of events you attend.

Matt

No matter how they set up which teams get to go, there is always going to be a lot of unhappy teams. I think FIRST has done the best job they can in this situation.

[Marc P.]

It's quite obvious FIRST has reasons for limiting the number in nationals. For one thing, there's only so many people that can fit in Epcot's parking lot city. Organizationally and logistically, over 300 teams can be a nightmare. (we have enough trouble managing just ours) Providing qualification requirements is just a "nice" way of limiting who can attend. Also, how fair of a competition is it when the first seed from one regional faces the last seed of another?

[AdamT]

Originally posted by Jordan A.
17*16=272

Now 17 = number of regionals
16 = number of teams in the elimination tournaments at each regional
272 = just 16 less than the intended first goal (288)

Jordan, you forgot one thing. Each alliance in the tournament is 3 teams. So it's 24*17=408 teams. Thats a bit more. Plus you forgot the three awards you can win at regionals to go to nationals, so that's another 51 teams. 459 teams total.

Even though we don't get to get in on the first come first serve teams this year, it makes you strive to have the best bot you can think up and build. At the same it also inspires us to improve other qualities of our team and work more on other, usually less thought of awards like the Chairman's Award. And if you think about it, in retrospect, the Chairman's Award *if awarded properly* is even more important then winning with the robot. Enough of morals and ethics.

Otherwise, for you graduating seniors, don't worry! I had two years of FIRST in high school and now, I'm not in college, but I am a mentor of two teams. There are a lot of colleges that are prime to have teams started. That's how our team got started.

[Mike Norton]

my 2 cents again on this subject.


If I only had to depend on our robot to win. these rules would be great. but when you have to depend on the luck of the draw ( if it is luck ).

You can have the best robot but if you get paired up with bad teams then you lose.

I still think everybody has to have a chance to win.


in the past I still can't under stand why we play with the same partners more than once and there are still team that we have not been paired up with.

It is all up to the FIRST gods.

[AdamT]

Oh course, being paired up with bad teams doesn't mean you're screwed, it just means you hope that other teams see that you've got a kick a** robot. We had horrible QP in regionals and made it to semi-finals our rookie year and finals last year.

Advertise, strategize, and pray to the holy gods of FIRST that someone notices you. That or you can go around and beg teams to pick you.

[Jordan A.]

Thanks for the correction on the math 401, I actually completely forgot about the third team.

Also I just want to make it clear that while I am "A little bitter..." I completely understand and agree with the ruling. I am not trying to whine and complain or "beat the dead horse" just sparking an interesting discussion on it. Which I think I accomplished.

Either way, I plan on starting a team next year with whatever University I go to.

Perhaps I might plan a RT (Road Trip) with other Canadian left outs.

[Jordan A.]

Happy follow up:

Team 781 was a member of the winning aliance at the Canadian regional. SO we are off to florida!!!!

[Mark Hamilton]

Originally posted by Jordan A.
Scott, you make a great point. I whipped out the calculator and a quick product gave a pretty good number

17*16=272

Now 17 = number of regionals
16 = number of teams in the elimination tournaments at each regional
272 = just 16 less than the intended first goal (288)

now I know its to late to start this, but if there is one more regional started up we have a pretty interesting solution, possibly for later years

Any thoughts?

Many teams get into eliminations at multiple regionals, so your # would probably fall short. Although if you added the judged award winners and top rookie seeds, it might get you closer to the number. FIRST currently seems torn between letting all teams have a shot at nationals and letting teams that have earned it come to nationals. If they choose the earn your way, I think they should seperate the regionals and Nationalsby a few more weeks to allow teams time to get the trip put togethor. Also we would need cooperation from Disney, as it will be very hard to reserve that # of hotel rooms that late in the season, maybe they could hold a set # of rooms for FIRST teams or soemthing.

[RebAl]

Originally posted by Mike Norton
my 2 cents again on this subject.


If I only had to depend on our robot to win. these rules would be great. but when you have to depend on the luck of the draw ( if it is luck ).

You can have the best robot but if you get paired up with bad teams then you lose.

I still think everybody has to have a chance to win.


in the past I still can't under stand why we play with the same partners more than once and there are still team that we have not been paired up with.

It is all up to the FIRST gods.

You can also go by winning a award, this seems to be generating more intrest in those now then without the restrictions.

[rees2001]

How about:

The top 8 seeds from each regional qualify 8
+
All finalists & winners of each regional 4 (- top seeds)
+
Chairmans award winners 1
+
Higest Rookie Seed 1 (possible top 8)
+
Rookie of the year 2 (possible top 8)
x
17 regionals
=_________________________________________________ _
total 272

This is close to the number & it eliminates human error. It stink if you didn't get the #1 seed because of a scoring error by the judges. This puts a little less focus on winning & a little more on doing well. If you feel like it throw in an other award because there will be some overlap from regional to regional.

[Koko Ed]

I Think alot of teams have to pass on Florida because they just don't have enough money. Whether or not you have a good robot doesn't mean a thing if your broke.
Also it isn't practical to send regonal champs, Chairman's award winner ect. You can't book rooms at Disney two weeks in advance. That just isn't going to happen.