Opinion Poll: Proliferation of Prefbricated Parts

[techhelpbb]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

I can tell you with 100% certainty that the game does not exist a year ahead of time. Please keep the borderline slanderous speculation bottled up.

Slander implies something criminal.
If you're going to be outraged - be informed about it.
Keep in mind I bought multiple robots from AndyMark <- if I was here to mess with them that's a poor way to do it.

I am implying nothing less than fact.
The AndyMark treads have started shipping just before a game well suited to them.

It may be speculative but it's so unusual that I really have to question the reasons.
So if Andy might explain how this timing occurred I would be interested - as it seems a little off.

Of course this could be the other way around.
Someone at GDC might of heard about the treads and made the game fit.
It would go a long way to explain why AndyMark didn't have enough tires in that case.

Finally there's possibility that someone partially disclosed an element (desired or planned) of the coming game. That it had tough terrain and they just deduced treads might be cool which wouldn't surprise me from experience. One wouldn't need to know exactly what the terrain would look like to deduce the value of treads.

Also before you go around suggesting I am speculating just to start trouble - don't bother.
Bits of information have come back to me over the years during various interactions with FIRST prior to games.
I sit on them because it's my choice to do so.

...

I just read Joe's post.
Okay option 2.

Andy didn't know but someone could have known he was working on that at FIRST.
I really am not looking to mess too much with Andy here again just to make this point:

Anyone vendor that can either influence the game decision (even unknowingly) or get pre-kickoff knowledge of it can deliver polished elements that it is entirely possible a team couldn't build themselves in the 6 weeks before bag and tag.
That would be great vendor business because it would make COTS purchases the only option to compete.

That's why I keep my mouth shut when I find out things early because I don't want that kind of stuff to happen.

[Joe Johnson]

Originally Posted by techhelpbb

<snip>
I am implying nothing less than fact.
The AndyMark treads have started shipping just before a game well suited to them.
<snip>

Come on man, don't kid a kidder. You're implying something untoward was involved, don't be hiding behind "I've never said that" type statements. Your original statements were not merely statements of fact of the kind "A happened, then shortly after that B happened." Own your words.

From your comments it is clear to me at least that you intended the readers to infer that AndyMark had a heads up on the 2016 game and that they then designed a COTS product to exploit that knowledge.

I have been clear on my views: I personally don't believe it.

You on the other hand want to have it both ways. I say, nay to this. Either you say, "yeah, that's what I think." or "I take it back."

I ask you to consider and respond.

Dr. Joe J.

[techhelpbb]

Originally Posted by Joe Johnson

Come on man, don't kid a kidder. You're implying something untoward was involved, don't be hiding behind "I've never said that" type statements. Your original statements were not merely statements of fact of the kind "A happened, then shortly after that B happened." Own your words.
...
Dr. Joe J.

Yes I -still- am implying something possibly untoward is involved.
That's no secret.
You can imply that it only goes towards Andy if you like but I am not.
His business does potentially stand to gain some nice bank there.

Then again his business also got publicly slammed by a bunch of people on ChiefDelphi for not being able to handle demand.
I posted in his favor then (I can look that up if you like).
It shouldn't surprise anyone that I don't think this COTS thing is panacea when the demand gets a little ugly.

So if you want to continue down there go ahead.
Point at me because the kick off secret is not as secret as you think it is.
What will that get you?
As you said - there are people that know ahead of time what's going on on both sides.
That transparently creates risk.

It can't be denied that more people asked for the disclosure of the game demands to the vendors ahead of time on ChieflDelphi when the COTS supplies were low for the treads and tires.
Releasing that information with consent would only make the cause and effect even more murky.

So which should concern me more...
1. That when we couldn't get our toys fast and cheap this got a little ugly?
2. That we traded the idea you had to be able to fend for yourself for the idea that COTS was limitless?
3. That we openly opened a can of worms by asking for pre-release of the game to only the vendors?
4. That it seems like there was some sharing of information already that allowed a synchronized event to appear?

This is a discussion about COTS. So here's what all that COTS has gotten us.
We should not forget that not all COTS supplies are limitless and now some teams are concerned they can't field a robot.
I won't blame AndyMark for that. Just like I may be making assumptions here - so many of you assumed their supply line was bottomless.