Witholding Allowance Rules

[Kevin Pai]

After the build season, we can keep 30 pounds of "fabricated" parts after putting away our robot. Are motors that were just attached to other pieces considered fabricated? Are motors included in this 30 pound limit?

[Mark McLeod]

Any COTS item like motors that are part of an assembly are included in the withholding limit.
Separate COTS motors like new in the box except for wire connectors unattached to anything else would not be counted.

[nuggetsyl]

Withhold allowance is a perfect example of what we should eliminate bag and tag.

[SamM]

To piggy back on this, how are the COTS rules interpreted with respect to gearboxes? My assumption is that an assembled versa planetary is not COTS because you can't buy them assembled, but a PG71 with motor is COTS, regardless of whether or not we bought the motor and gearbox separately because it is possible to buy them together?

[nuggetsyl]

Originally Posted by SamM

To piggy back on this, how are the COTS rules interpreted with respect to gearboxes? My assumption is that an assembled versa planetary is not COTS because you can't buy them assembled, but a PG71 with motor is COTS, regardless of whether or not we bought the motor and gearbox separately because it is possible to buy them together?

Another great example of why we need to get rid of bag and tag. These rules are unenforceable. If FIRST is not worried about who wins or loses they should not worry about stuff like this.

[rich2202]

Originally Posted by nuggetsyl

Another great example of why we need to get rid of bag and tag.

Just because it is not strictly enforced does not mean the rule is useless. Gracious professionalism - follow the rules even when no one is watching.

Are motors that were just attached to other pieces considered fabricated?

If the motor was not purchased attached, then it is fabricated. You can have extra motors outside the hold back for spares, but they must be just the motor with changes allowed by R13-D.

To piggy back on this, how are the COTS rules interpreted with respect to gearboxes? My assumption is that an assembled versa planetary is not COTS because you can't buy them assembled, but a PG71 with motor is COTS, regardless of whether or not we bought the motor and gearbox separately because it is possible to buy them together?

If you can buy it pre-assembled, then it is COTS. No different between sheet of metal and chassis.

IMHO, it is hard to have an assembled gearbox not be Fabricated because it usually requires attaching a motor. The gearbox with a motor are the exception.

[SamM]

Originally Posted by rich2202

IMHO, it is hard to have an assembled gearbox not be Fabricated because it usually requires attaching a motor. The gearbox with a motor are the exception.

The versa planetaries are designed such that you can assemble a gearbox without the motor, then attach the motor and/or mounting plate later.

We were also wondering if we need to clean the grease off of the gears, or if it is sufficient to disassemble the gearbox, but leave the grease?

I miss the old 'SPARE PARTS' rule.

Thanks

[rich2202]

I say bring the gearboxes disassembled to the competition, assign a few students to assembling them during the practice rounds. After the competition, include the gearboxes in the bag with the robot so you can use them at the next competition without having to assemble them.

[MrBasse]

Originally Posted by SamM

The versa planetaries are designed such that you can assemble a gearbox without the motor, then attach the motor and/or mounting plate later.

We were also wondering if we need to clean the grease off of the gears, or if it is sufficient to disassemble the gearbox, but leave the grease?

I miss the old 'SPARE PARTS' rule.

Thanks

When purchased the gears are oiled, so Id say grease is fine. Since they come unassembled in the box, just make sure to bring them that way and then add your stages once you get to your event.

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by Mark McLeod

Any COTS item like motors that are part of an assembly are included in the withholding limit.
Separate COTS motors like new in the box except for wire connectors unattached to anything else would not be counted.

Not quite. While COTS items with wire connectors added are counted as COTS for purposes of including on this year's robot (Exception R13 D), they are not exempt from being included in the withholding allowance (R18 only has two stated exceptions, though bumpers are an implied exception to bag and tag under R15).