Pneumatic Regulators from Automation Direct

[Tristan Lall]

I'm inclined to continue using the past interpretation of the rule to resolve the Norgren issue in favour of legality. Since a Norgren R07-100-RNEA regulator can frequently¹ be adjusted above 50 lb/in² (the manufacturer's operating limit²) and even above 60 lb/in² (the R77-I limit) using the provided control knob, and FIRST should know this, I would interpret the "maximum outlet pressure" to mean the maximum non-transient pressure at the outlet given a certain user-adjusted setting, rather than the manufacturer's published operating limits or proof limits. This also permits R75 to be read without conflict: the "working pressure" referenced there should be interpreted in terms of the possible range of input pressures, not the adjustment range of the outlet.

Using that logic, the AutomationDirect valve, the Nitra AR-213 is also legal. For R77-I, you must adjust its outlet to 60 lb/in² or less, and the datasheet states this is possible. For R75, the "working pressure" at the inlet should be no more than 145 lb/in² if like the Norgren, you may operate it in excess of recommendations, or no more than 130 lb/in² if you must stay within the manufacturer's range. Either figure satisfies R75.

Also, for anyone concerned about unsafe failure of the regulator, Nitra conveniently provides proof limits: below 215 lb/in², you should not expect the regulator to fail catastrophically.

For better or worse, guidance provided to LRIs is not inherently a rule, and cannot be enforced.

¹I don't know what the production variation is on the physical limit of adjustment, so perhaps I'm relying on outliers to reach that impression.
² For regular customers at least. I seem to recall, but can't document, a Q&A from the early 2000s alluding to Norgren telling FIRST that operating this regulator up to 60 lb/in² was acceptable.

[martin417]

Has anybody submitted a Q&A on this topic? Would be nice to get clarification before the next event.

[Holtzman]

Originally Posted by martin417

Has anybody submitted a Q&A on this topic? Would be nice to get clarification before the next event.

Yes.

[FrankJ]

Originally Posted by Holtzman

Yes.

It might be good to point out to the Q&A people that the recommended regulator can be adjusted to above 60 PSI.

[Holtzman]

Originally Posted by FrankJ

It might be good to point out to the Q&A people that the recommended regulator can be adjusted to above 60 PSI.

Ya, the original question was quite a bit longer and pointed out all the important details touched on in this thread. There is a character limit on q and a's that made adding more details impossible though.

I could have linked this thread, but I suspect the deciding parties are already aware of whats been stated here.

[AllenGregoryIV]

Originally Posted by Holtzman

Ya, the original question was quite a bit longer and pointed out all the important details touched on in this thread. There is a character limit on q and a's that made adding more details impossible though.

I could have linked this thread, but I suspect the deciding parties are already aware of whats been stated here.

Yeah I've been trying to get them to remove or at least liberally increase the character limit for a couple years. I think they made it a bit larger last year but still not good enough. VEX Q&A forum is still better at this, they can post photos and things to help communicate their questions.

[FrankJ]

Q & A has spoken with much appreciated clarity.

Q. Is the intent of R77I to limit teams to only using Pressure regulators with a published operating range of less than 60 PSI, or is this meant to allow regulators with an operating range above 60 PSI provided they are adjusted such that the working pressure is at or below 60PSI?
2016-02-27 by FRC2056
A. The meaning of R77-I was unclear, sorry about that. It will be revised in Team Update 14 to allow pressure regulators with the outlet pressure adjusted to 60 psi or less. Regulators with an operating range above 60 psi will be allowed provided they are adjusted to no more than 60 psi.

[Jon Stratis]

And that just made inspecting pneumatic systems a lot easier than it was looking over the past week!

[Karthik]

Originally Posted by Jon Stratis

And that just made inspecting pneumatic systems a lot easier than it was looking over the past week!

Indeed. This was a smart answer fueled by common sense on the part of the GDC. Definitely helpful to teams and volunteers alike.

[Paul Copioli]

Once again the GDC under Frank Merrick's leadership is the most professional and most reasonable during all my years of participating in FRC.

The practical and team centric approach that FRC has been taking during the "Frank Era" of FRC is very much appreciated.

What a courteous and professional response.

Paul

[Ryan Dognaux]

Are there any other 'less used but legal' pneumatics components that Automation Direct sells? We have a ton of old dials, regulators, brass fittings, etc. and I'd like to know some of the parts you guys have found to be better for FRC applications. Thanks for posting this to the Q&A!

[AllenGregoryIV]

Originally Posted by Ryan Dognaux

Are there any other 'less used but legal' pneumatics components that Automation Direct sells? We have a ton of old dials, regulators, brass fittings, etc. and I'd like to know some of the parts you guys have found to be better for FRC applications. Thanks for posting this to the Q&A!

Inline regulators and gauges could be useful if you need weight or space.

Quick exhaust valves are legal for the first time this year.

3 Way exhaust valves are also legal this year for closing off sections of pneumatics

Not from automation direct but McMaster and other sources carry tiny gauges (paintball sized) that are lighter. You can also get aluminum and plastic manifolds as well.

[bachster]

Originally Posted by AllenGregoryIV

3 Way exhaust valves are also legal this year for closing off sections of pneumatics

If using these, just remember that you still must meet R89:

Originally Posted by R89

Any pressure vent plug must be:

A. connected to the pneumatic circuit such that, when manually operated, it will vent to the atmosphere to relieve all stored pressure in a reasonable amount of time, and

B. placed on the ROBOT so that it is visible and easily accessible.

If the compressor is not used on the ROBOT, then an additional pressure vent plug must be connected to the high-pressure portion of the pneumatic circuit off-board the ROBOT with the
compressor (see R80).

Does anyone have an example of a useful application for the 3-way exhaust valve?

[bachster]

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli

The practical and team centric approach that FRC has been taking during the "Frank Era" of FRC is very much appreciated.

What a courteous and professional response.

Paul

100% agreed. Thanks also to all of the professional comments in this thread which helped to provide well-reasoned technical insight. This is a great update which benefits teams, RI's and LRI's. Now we can go back to worrying about more exciting things like bumpers and bagging two "robots."

[Kellen Hill]

Great news! We used the setup below for our robot last year and really liked it compared to massive regulators involving brass and large gauges.



Regulator

Pressure Gauge