Scoring/game issues

[MikLast]

Originally Posted by alicen

Are you sure that the scale points were assigned incorrectly? Because the way you're describing it is kind of impossible.

The refs that score scales happen immediately after the end of the match, but the ones that score red side don't even look at or score blue side, and vice versa.

I can't say for sure what happened, but I don't think they awarded your scale to another team without some very serious mistakes. It would involve a ref walking to the other end of the field to put in your scale on a different ref panel, then have that scale be corroborated by the other ref on that end of the field saying "yup, that scale happened"

While 4980 was not successful in this match, they were the only ones scaling at west valley, as the match video for this match confirms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p7j...QJu4n&index=45 (at least this one was posted, many from here are mislabeled or outright missing.) Its fairly obvious they were the only ones scaling that match, and thus the Blue alliance should not of gotten the scaling points.

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by MikLast

While 4980 was not successful in this match, they were the only ones scaling at west valley, as the match video for this match confirms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p7j...QJu4n&index=45 (at least this one was posted, many from here are mislabeled or outright missing.) Its fairly obvious they were the only ones scaling that match, and thus the Blue alliance should not of gotten the scaling points.

Are you sure no foul was called because those can add scaling points to other alliance.

[MikLast]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Are you sure no foul was called because those can add scaling points to other alliance.

Wouldnt fouls be called as fouls and not a scale?
https://www.thebluealliance.com/match/2016waspo_qm45

Originally Posted by Navid Shafa

Another big issue this week:

Teams clearly crossing defenses 5 or 6 times, before the defense is scored as damaged...

Another issue is defenses being counted as damaged incorrectly, as in match 1 for the same event (watch 4513's bot and the low bar during the beginning of teleop https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Iik...hQJu4n&index=1) At least this match was replayed the next day.

[MrBasse]

Originally Posted by MikLast

Another issue is defenses being counted as damaged incorrectly, as in match 1 for the same event (watch 4513's bot and the low bar during the beginning of teleop https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Iik...hQJu4n&index=1) At least this match was replayed the next day.

It got counted, but not until the timer reached 110 seconds left.

[MikLast]

Originally Posted by MrBasse

It got counted, but not until the timer reached 110 seconds left.

Watch around the 90 second mark. That should not of counted.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Are you sure no foul was called because those can add scaling points to other alliance.

G28, for those that need a reference.

G17 may also apply if someone's jumping the gun.


The combination of those two could easily generate that result.

[nedwards28]

Originally Posted by EricH

G28, for those that need a reference.

G17 may also apply if someone's jumping the gun.


The combination of those two could easily generate that result.

So, here is the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p7joyGrT8g

MikLast is right. We didn't make it up high enough for the scale. And, while the video doesn't show our third player, the robot is clearly in their own courtyard at the end of the match near an opposing robot. I'm guessing they were playing defense well into the last 20 seconds and cost us that 15 points. This is really good to know as it's a HUGE penalty and would explain why there are scaling points all over the place even though no one else is scaling. It would be nice to have it labeled as a penalty instead of a scale. That would help us trying to figure out the scoring stuff.

The final score for them gives them a scale but no challenge. So, I don't know what robot was hit but, it would seem like the red bot had to hit the blue one on the battery for red to not pick up 20 points total instead of the just the 15.

I appreciate the help in this!

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by nedwards28

So, here is the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p7joyGrT8g

MikLast is right. We didn't make it up high enough for the scale. And, while the video doesn't show our third player, the robot is clearly in their own courtyard at the end of the match near an opposing robot. I'm guessing they were playing defense well into the last 20 seconds and cost us that 15 points. This is really good to know as it's a HUGE penalty and would explain why there are scaling points all over the place even though no one else is scaling. It would be nice to have it labeled as a penalty instead of a scale. That would help us trying to figure out the scoring stuff.

The final score for them gives them a scale but no challenge. So, I don't know what robot was hit but, it would seem like the red bot had to hit the blue one on the battery for red to not pick up 20 points total instead of the just the 15.

I appreciate the help in this!

I think they do that because that is the same as the infinite height time to scale and most bots need full 20 seconds to scale. So they count is as scaling because who knows what would have really occurred without an interfering defensive bot?

Going to have to remind our drive team to remind our alliance partners to tag bots when they hear the 20 second warning if in our courtyard..that's a lot of points.

[Jeffrafa]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Going to have to remind our drive team to remind our alliance partners to tag bots when they hear the 20 second warning if in our courtyard..that's a lot of points.

Beware of G11 here. If you run into an opponent in their courtyard on your way to the tower in the last 20 seconds then G28 will grant you scale points, but if you are clearly chasing down an opponent in their courtyard just to 'tag' them, then G11 kicks in and you could earn yourself a penalty instead.

Originally Posted by G28 Blue Box

Teams are encouraged to consider rule G11 when developing their strategies, such as attempting to draw violations of this rule.

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by Jeffrafa

Beware of G11 here. If you run into an opponent in their courtyard on your way to the tower in the last 20 seconds then G28 will grant you scale points, but if you are clearly chasing down an opponent in their courtyard just to 'tag' them, then G11 kicks in and you could earn yourself a penalty instead.

Ok thanks for the reminder

AS for scale points from original OP was that a G28 last 20 second contact in opponents courtyard...that adds scale points

[Navid Shafa]

Another big issue this week:

Teams clearly crossing defenses 5 or 6 times, before the defense is scored as damaged...

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by Navid Shafa

Another big issue this week:

Teams clearly crossing defenses 5 or 6 times, before the defense is scored as damaged...

Yup tell me about it cost us 2 RP by end of day 1, I wish there were sensors lots going on its hard on refs but affects ranking we beat alliance #1 2-0 because #8 alliance was loaded with quality bots ..that should not happen if ranking is not skewed by missed RP's which put us about 6 places back from where we should have been ranked.

I get where First is coming from but this explains in part why lower alliances are doing really good this year . They ARE good and using the "extra time not wasted on crossing defenses again and again" instead on elimination alliances scoring. Not very fair to #1 and #2 alliances if stronger top 10ish bots are artificially ranked lower.

[Daniel_LaFleur]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Yup tell me about it cost us 2 RP by end of day 1, I wish there were sensors lots going on its hard on refs but affects ranking we beat alliance #1 2-0 because #8 alliance was loaded with quality bots ..that should not happen if ranking is not skewed by missed RP's which put us about 6 places back from where we should have been ranked.

I get where First is coming from but this explains in part why lower alliances are doing really good this year . They ARE good and using the "extra time not wasted on crossing defenses again and again" instead on elimination alliances scoring. Not very fair to #1 and #2 alliances if stronger top 10ish bots are artificially ranked lower.

Any team that picks by rank only gets what they deserve.

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur

Any team that picks by rank only gets what they deserve.

True but its the difference in us being Alliance captain or a very strong first pick of another very strong bot. Not sure if it would have changed the outcomes but it is something to consider

[indieFan]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Yup tell me about it cost us 2 RP by end of day 1, I wish there were sensors lots going on its hard on refs but affects ranking we beat alliance #1 2-0 because #8 alliance was loaded with quality bots ..that should not happen if ranking is not skewed by missed RP's which put us about 6 places back from where we should have been ranked.

I get where First is coming from but this explains in part why lower alliances are doing really good this year . They ARE good and using the "extra time not wasted on crossing defenses again and again" instead on elimination alliances scoring. Not very fair to #1 and #2 alliances if stronger top 10ish bots are artificially ranked lower.

You lost 2 RP which sucks. However, you and your alliance partner(s) for that match lost 2 RP for the match which any of you may or may not have contributed to. The good teams are not ranked lower because of scoring issues, but because of the nature of random alliance partners and whether they chose to build a robot that plays for the qualification rounds or the elimination rounds. Many years in Los Angeles, teams ranked quite low would be chosen for alliances because they were built specifically to play the elimination rounds and compliment other team's abilities.