Scoring/game issues

[MrBasse]

Originally Posted by alicen

I can't really speak for the accuracy of TBA scores or where the blue alliance scale points came from, etc

The only thing I really can say is that it's highly unlikely that they counted your scale for blue instead.

After watching the video of the match, your robot (4980) was not actually high enough to score a scale. You have to have ALL of your robot lifted above the top of the opening for the low goal

Where is the video? You only need your bumpers to be over the low goal to score scale points.

[BrennanB]

Originally Posted by Navid Shafa

Another big issue this week:

Teams clearly crossing defenses 5 or 6 times, before the defense is scored as damaged...

I noticed that as well. Seems like the refs are very occupied to notice.

[MikLast]

Originally Posted by MrBasse

Where is the video? You only need your bumpers to be over the low goal to score scale points.

Its a little up in the thread, but here it is again https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p7j...QJu4n&index=45

They were not high enough, that was established. It was their first try at scaling also. The issue there WAS a scaling awarded, and to the wrong alliance.

[alicen]

edit -- MikLast beat me to it!

[nedwards28]

Originally Posted by alicen

I can't really speak for the accuracy of TBA scores or where the blue alliance scale points came from, etc

The only thing I really can say is that it's highly unlikely that they counted your scale for blue instead.

After watching the video of the match, your robot (4980) was not actually high enough to score a scale. You have to have ALL of your robot lifted above the top of the opening for the low goal

Yeah, I agree that would be pretty outrageous to give a scale to another team. I think we are getting this figured out. I honestly did not realize G28. So, learning moment for me. Thanks for the input on how the referees score those. I wasn't sure how the referees keep track of stuff. That's good to know!

[catmanjake]

In our regional, we are only aware of one issue. We had breached the defenses but it was not counted as a rank point. We had a student immediately go to the challenge box. Within 2 minutes, they corrected the score.

I do know the referees were very picky on certain defenses but they warned all of our drivers about at initial driver meeting. Very rarely could a team on their own damage the sally port unless they showed a big gap between the robot and the door. I had no issue with most of their no damage calls. I am sure when we get the replays, we will see many instances where a robot separated from door by a couple inches but a tough call for the referee. Again, no issue on my end as this was explained prior to the start of the contest.

[GaryVoshol]

Where was 3876 at the end of the match? They're not in the shot that closes in on 4890's scale attempt. They could have very well been down at the other end of the field, came in contact with a blue robot, and earned blue a free scale per G28. They get credited with a scale even if none of their robots are capable of scaling.

[Daniel_LaFleur]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Yup tell me about it cost us 2 RP by end of day 1, I wish there were sensors lots going on its hard on refs but affects ranking we beat alliance #1 2-0 because #8 alliance was loaded with quality bots ..that should not happen if ranking is not skewed by missed RP's which put us about 6 places back from where we should have been ranked.

I get where First is coming from but this explains in part why lower alliances are doing really good this year . They ARE good and using the "extra time not wasted on crossing defenses again and again" instead on elimination alliances scoring. Not very fair to #1 and #2 alliances if stronger top 10ish bots are artificially ranked lower.

Any team that picks by rank only gets what they deserve.

[indieFan]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Yup tell me about it cost us 2 RP by end of day 1, I wish there were sensors lots going on its hard on refs but affects ranking we beat alliance #1 2-0 because #8 alliance was loaded with quality bots ..that should not happen if ranking is not skewed by missed RP's which put us about 6 places back from where we should have been ranked.

I get where First is coming from but this explains in part why lower alliances are doing really good this year . They ARE good and using the "extra time not wasted on crossing defenses again and again" instead on elimination alliances scoring. Not very fair to #1 and #2 alliances if stronger top 10ish bots are artificially ranked lower.

You lost 2 RP which sucks. However, you and your alliance partner(s) for that match lost 2 RP for the match which any of you may or may not have contributed to. The good teams are not ranked lower because of scoring issues, but because of the nature of random alliance partners and whether they chose to build a robot that plays for the qualification rounds or the elimination rounds. Many years in Los Angeles, teams ranked quite low would be chosen for alliances because they were built specifically to play the elimination rounds and compliment other team's abilities.

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur

Any team that picks by rank only gets what they deserve.

True but its the difference in us being Alliance captain or a very strong first pick of another very strong bot. Not sure if it would have changed the outcomes but it is something to consider

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by indieFan

You lost 2 RP which sucks. However, you and your alliance partner(s) for that match lost 2 RP for the match which any of you may or may not have contributed to. The good teams are not ranked lower because of scoring issues, but because of the nature of random alliance partners and whether they chose to build a robot that plays for the qualification rounds or the elimination rounds. Many years in Los Angeles, teams ranked quite low would be chosen for alliances because they were built specifically to play the elimination rounds and compliment other team's abilities.

It was two separate matches breaches were not scored and yes good teams do get ranked lower when RP is a first order sort

[waialua359]

Originally Posted by catmanjake

I do know the referees were very picky on certain defenses but they warned all of our drivers about at initial driver meeting. Very rarely could a team on their own damage the sally port unless they showed a big gap between the robot and the door. I had no issue with most of their no damage calls. I am sure when we get the replays, we will see many instances where a robot separated from door by a couple inches but a tough call for the referee. Again, no issue on my end as this was explained prior to the start of the contest.

The only obvious error I found with the Sally Door is when 1 robot holds the door for 2 to cross and it doesnt count as breached.

[Mr_D_Mentor]

At Waterbury, it was stressed at the Sunday morning driver meeting that the robot must completely clear the defense in order for it to count. Then they proceeded to award numerous autonomous crossings that shouldn't have been. I could only see one side of the field, so I don't know if it was happening on both sides. If it was only happening on one side, the red alliance had the advantage.

[Boltman]

Originally Posted by nedwards28

So, here is the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p7joyGrT8g

MikLast is right. We didn't make it up high enough for the scale. And, while the video doesn't show our third player, the robot is clearly in their own courtyard at the end of the match near an opposing robot. I'm guessing they were playing defense well into the last 20 seconds and cost us that 15 points. This is really good to know as it's a HUGE penalty and would explain why there are scaling points all over the place even though no one else is scaling. It would be nice to have it labeled as a penalty instead of a scale. That would help us trying to figure out the scoring stuff.

The final score for them gives them a scale but no challenge. So, I don't know what robot was hit but, it would seem like the red bot had to hit the blue one on the battery for red to not pick up 20 points total instead of the just the 15.

I appreciate the help in this!

I think they do that because that is the same as the infinite height time to scale and most bots need full 20 seconds to scale. So they count is as scaling because who knows what would have really occurred without an interfering defensive bot?

Going to have to remind our drive team to remind our alliance partners to tag bots when they hear the 20 second warning if in our courtyard..that's a lot of points.

[Jeffrafa]

Originally Posted by Boltman

Going to have to remind our drive team to remind our alliance partners to tag bots when they hear the 20 second warning if in our courtyard..that's a lot of points.

Beware of G11 here. If you run into an opponent in their courtyard on your way to the tower in the last 20 seconds then G28 will grant you scale points, but if you are clearly chasing down an opponent in their courtyard just to 'tag' them, then G11 kicks in and you could earn yourself a penalty instead.

Originally Posted by G28 Blue Box

Teams are encouraged to consider rule G11 when developing their strategies, such as attempting to draw violations of this rule.