Galileo Teams: Collusion, yes or no?

[Paul Copioli]

Some people are missing the point. Leaving stacks is an obvious good strategy and many teams use it. However, at a few regionals overt pre-game colluding occured and it reflected in some of the matches. Talk to individuals at those regionals and they will tell you the stories (Arizona & Florida, for example).

The point of this poll is to get a sense of what the teams in Galileo are thinking when it comes to collusion.

Now, here is my position (and this is the last I will post about the subject). Sometimes in life you must take a stand and stick by it. I don't care what the rules say (or what loopholes some may think exist), but pre-determining ANY part of a competition meant to put 2 teams against each other is cheating. No "what ifs", no "but FIRST meant it to be this way". That is all bull! It is cheating and if you were held to an honor code (many schools are) and practiced this behavior, you would be disciplined. Here is one of many examples I can think of:

2 football teams get together before a game and discuss letting each others' punt returners run back every punt to the goal line, because they want to boost each teams punt return stats. They agree to play the rest of the game as normal and see how things pan out. Sports fans would be outraged (as they should be) and would accuse all involved of cheating.

Our QP boosting collusion advocates are doing the same thing.


Ask yourself this question: Could you look Dean or Woody in the eye and tell them that colluding with the opposition before a match is O.K.? .... I couldn't.

-Paul

[Jeff Waegelin]

I'm not in Galileo division, but I agree with what Paul says. Sometimes, leaving stacks can be beneficial to both teams. In those situations, I would have no problem with letting both stacks stay, giving each team more points. What I will not do, however, is make a pre-determined agreement not to knock over those stacks. If it helps me, I'll leave them, but I make no promises. Not ever.

[Mark Garver]

Originally posted by Paul Copioli
I'm with Andy and Aidan on this one. The Thunderchickens will not collude, without exception.

I will say that our game plan hasn't changed in 3 regionals. Leave all stacks alone until you need to destroy them ... this only makes sense.

-Paul

As Alex stated in an earlier post, Team 68 will not take part in any collusion.

Paul,

While I agree with your statement that you need not touch the boxes until you need to destroy them, Team 68 has worked out a few rules of thumb about knocking stacks over that can be determined as soon as the HP mood is over as well as a few moves the HP is to default to if something changes on the field during the HP time that I (coach) or drive team was unaware of before the match (put your thinking cap on ). While we may not get the highest scores, this method has worked rather well for winning matches as well as placing high in QPs (2nd and 7th). I agree totally with leaving stacks for the other team, I just worry some times about missing a box or two and not winning the match because of it. Leaving the other team with stacks is a good method and a method that we use that has not failed yet, knock on wood!! Leaving the stacks is the call the drivers and coaches, alone with the human player should make on the field, not before the match. Good luck and hope to see you in T minus 5 days.

(PM me and let me know where you guys are staying again and if you can figure out what our rule of thumb is, Thanks)

[WakeZero]

Please keep the debate in the 100s of other threads please

[Josh Hambright]

461 will not participate in Collusion or rigging matches or cheating or gentelmans agreements or whatever you want to call it.

We have not and do not plan on doing it.

My main problem with it, is that if alot of teams start doing it (and i had heard rumors of this occuring atleast in cleveland) is that teams will make the agreement and then 1 team will back out at the last minute and stab their opponents in the back. This is an extreme opposite to the philosophy of gracious professionalism that FIRST is built around.

I agree with what Paul said about telling Dean and Woody this. Obviously this isn't what FIRST intended with the game this year or they would have pointed it out as part of the strategy.

So basicly to sum it all up: 461 will not and has not collude at any point this season.

[Cory]

Originally posted by Aidan F. Browne
Note: I am not trying to start a debate here -- there are other threads for that.

There are some greatly differing opinions on collusion (a.k.a. rigging matches to obtain ultra-high scores).

I don't want our division to be torn apart by these differences in opinion.

I would greatly prefer that we all come to understand each other so we can have an awesome three days of competition.

In order to open that discussion, I am posting this poll so we can collect some data to find out how we are all approaching this issue.

Good luck to everyone -- we have an awesome division!




Added 03/03 ---> I had specifically requested that this not turn into a personal debate of opinions -- that has happened in many other threads. I intended this thread to be a statement of Team intent for Galileo teams only, not personal opinion. Please respect that. If you feel you must post your personal opinion and not your team's stance, then please do it elsewhere. If you are in another division, please read, but do not post. Thanks!

Can you add a "I really dont give a darn and I am sick of hearing this" option?

Cory

[Harrison]

Originally posted by Aidan F. Browne
For the record:

- I do not believe in collusion in this years game.
- I will not participate in collusion.
- the Buzz team does not support collusion.
- the Buzz team will not participate in collusion

Team 783 definitely will not participate in collusion.

[Solace]

If an opponent has a stack, we generally won't knock it down unless its absolutely necessary - why be destructive and knock over enemy stacks, when stealing them is so much more fun! it gets more cheers from the crowd too.

[OZ_341]

Team 341 will NOT seek pre-game agreements.

Good luck to all in Houston!!

Al Ostrow
Coach of 341

[pbarrett03]

Here we go again... There was no obvious point colluding at the SVR. It made the competition more interesting and reflect what actually happened on the field, not how persuasive a team could be to fix a match before hand.

We will be in Houston to compete, not to collude in this years game... Stack Attack

As far as collusion goes,
JUST SAY NO