COMM lost way to many times

[Schnabel]

Originally Posted by pfreivald

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It's aggravating to have failures in KOP devices that we're required to use on our robot, but cannot repair or upgrade to something more reliable. FRC requires robust components, and expecting teams to deal with internal failures of KOP parts used in a manner consistent with their intended purpose as "part of the game" is not acceptable--quality control on FRC KOP components should be top notch, and it simply isn't.

(The "tested" sticker on the back of the PCP was a bit of an insult-to-injury chunk of irony. They said it was tested...but never said whether or not it worked.)

Out of curiosity, have you contacted CTR-E to see if they can help determine the root cause for the PDP and PCM? They are very easy to work with and very smart, I wouldn't be surprised if they end up helping find a root cause for both and then helping you get it fixed. Additionally how long did it take for you to replace what you assumed (and later verified) are bad components? I'd like to take this time to remind everyone that Spare Parts has multiple of these required components specifically for teams who are having issues. It's understood that you cannot open or modify them, so swap them out for an event and see if that helps.

Originally Posted by Joe Johnson

Does anyone have data on the frequency, number, and duration of COMM problems over time (meaning year over year)?...

Joe, I get you are trying to stay unbiased in this, but you are also trying to point fingers at FIRST for any dropped communication issues that appear on the field. That isn't a fair assessment. There's still a level of responsibility for the teams to take care of their own hardware and ensure that their robots are capable of playing the game at hand. Teams that take the time to make their wiring clean and ensure proper connections and relief and provided to their electronics rarely have issues. For example, one of the teams who dropped comms constantly at a previous event I attended had a rats nest of wires and relied on gravity and double sided tape to hold pieces together. Every time they lost comm we were able to determine what had come loose. Sometimes comms drop and a cause cannot be determined, that's just a fact of life when you are on the field. Even on my high school team this happened, eventually we found the issue or found a work around to prevent it (looking at you, 2009 bot who wouldn't boot properly every time). My point is, there are a lot of troubleshooting steps teams can and should take prior to entering the field to play. These include tug tests, checking for loose connectors, etc. You wouldn't believe the number of teams I've told to do that very thing (even at the drivers meeting) and they don't.

I don't have any data to back me up, but here are my general impressions of the control system year over year. Note that when a robot drops I attempt to do everything in my power (and allotted time) to find the issue on the field itself. I hate phantom issues showing up in the middle of a match. It's not inspiring to the students, it's not fun, it may provide a challenge to the teams, but they shouldn't have to worry about these types of issues during a 2.5 minute span. I would say I have about a 90% success rate and determining and replicating the issue on the field.

2011 - 2013 - I remember hating the control system during these years, I just can't remember exactly why.

2014 - Horrible comm drops due to multiple issues and with no way to easily explain why. I remember issues with the radio and crio rebooting in the middle of a match being most common. This was caused primarily by brown outs to either, or loose wiring. The brown outs occured most frequently in the last 60 seconds of a match, especially when the robot started playing defense. Pushing matches stressed the control system beyond what it could handle. Additionally I remember parts of the control system having to be swapped out randomly due to shorts and failures (digital side car, radio power converter, etc.)

2015 - Hardly any comm drops compared to previous years. This was a refreshing turn after concerns of switching to a new control system. There were multiple factors that helped including the low stress on the robots, stronger connections (when wired properly), brow-out protection being built into the roborio, and the vrm keeping the radio alive during short voltage drops that were low enough to take out the rio. There were multiple instances of robots dropping below the rio's threshold, causing a reboot, but the radio stayed up and connected. This was the most solid I've ever felt our control system has been.

2016 - I feel like this year is some-what in between 2014 and 2016. Issues from wires coming loose or pulling out are back due to the intensity of the game, but we still have many of the protections in place that helped the control system in 2015 feel solid (vrm and brownout protection). The big issue I see this year is just how long it takes to get communication back with your robot. A team can die at the start of teleop, then start moving with 20 seconds left. One of the most annoying aspects of this year's control system is starting robot code after the DS has full communication back up. It can take the 50 seconds it takes the radio to boot up to nearly 70+ seconds just for the robot to be enabled again. In other words, if you drop, the chances of coming back in time are slim.