Wisconsin Regional 2016

[themagic8ball]

Originally Posted by JPL69

We found the archive links for the WI Regional on YouTube, but cannot seem to view Saturday's qualifying matches. We get a "This video contains content form UMG_MK, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds. Sorry about that."

Has anyone found a work-around for viewing Saturday's qualifying matches?

We'll get this situation figured out, but the team isn't meeting this week until Thursday due to Spring Break. Hopefully next week sometime we can get everything uploaded with the audio stripped.

[Sunshine]

I'd be in favor of districts only if we can keep same venue for championship. It's a completely different experience than a field house.

[MrHero]

Originally Posted by JPL69

We found the archive links for the WI Regional on YouTube, but cannot seem to view Saturday's qualifying matches. We get a "This video contains content form UMG_MK, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds. Sorry about that."

Has anyone found a work-around for viewing Saturday's qualifying matches?

The videos are available on Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/wisconsin_frc

The audio cuts out here and there, but the video is good for both days.

Jeff

[Ernst]

Originally Posted by Sunshine

I'd be in favor of districts only if we can keep same venue for championship. It's a completely different experience than a field house.

That would be great. If we were to switch for the 2018 season, I would assume around 50-60 teams, so we would likely have 3 or 4 events. I think one or two Milwaukee events, a La Crosse event, and a Fox Valley event would be a good way to split everything up. A DCMP in Milwaukee would be nice for the teams there.

I'm a bit worried that a lot of WI teams currently only do one event. This year 22 of WI's 48 teams are only attending one Regional. Several more are doing just that and Champs. Adding another 2 events in between to make it to Champs seems like a lot to ask for teams with less funding, but the state grants should help alleviate some of that. And hey, other regions have solved all of these problems already.

[Christopher149]

Originally Posted by ZehP

That would be great. If we were to switch for the 2018 season, I would assume around 50-60 teams, so we would likely have 3 or 4 events. I think one or two Milwaukee events, a La Crosse event, and a Fox Valley event would be a good way to split everything up. A DCMP in Milwaukee would be nice for the teams there.

I'm a bit worried that a lot of WI teams currently only do one event. This year 22 of WI's 48 teams are only attending one Regional. Several more are doing just that and Champs. Adding another 2 events in between to make it to Champs seems like a lot to ask for teams with less funding, but the state grants should help alleviate some of that. And hey, other regions have solved all of these problems already.

An event near Appleton/Green Bay might get some UP teams down to Wisconsin for a third play, and Wisconsin could come up to Escanaba. And Wisconsin might then start growing north of Wausau.

[Sunshine]

Getting teams the ability to do more than one competition is a great idea if that's what they want. I have read threads here that indicate the money savings going to districts is not that substantial if at all. Sadly, I know mentors who like the one and done approach. We do (can afford) two events every year so the difference is not great. I also like the ability for our students to travel to different regions for ten experience. That becomes more difficult when everyone does districts I believe.

As far as the state money goes, I hope it's used to expand the teams in Wisconsin. There are many teams who are financially stable and are not hurting for more funds. The money needs to be used wisely. These kinds of funds generally do not last long. Teams who really do not need it should not get greedy so growth can occur.

Again, I hope that locations are not in gyms. Takes the ambiance away from it being something real special IMHO. I hope that more colleges get involved and offer their buildings. That could/is more of a win win for everyone I think.

[EricLeifermann]

Originally Posted by Sunshine

Again, I hope that locations are not in gyms. Takes the ambiance away from it being something real special IMHO. I hope that more colleges get involved and offer their buildings. That could/is more of a win win for everyone I think.

Have you competed in a district competition or even been to one? What about IRI? Do you feel that event is less because its in a gym?

I thought the same things back in 2009 when Michigan 1st went to districts. I even fought heavily against it, though my reasons were more financial than playing in HS gyms.

I can say with 1st hand knowledge that competing in a gym does not take away from the experience one bit.

I can also say that districts help growth. Both on the amount of teams, but more importantly on the quality of teams.

Thanks to districts team 857, which I mentored in college, has flourished. They were a perennial one and done team occasionally going to Champs through signing up(when that was still an option) not earning it. They have earned it the last 2 years now and have won district EI twice I think, as well as being an alliance captain at champs this last year, and several district finalists, and other judged awards.

I have yet to experience a negative with districts. It is the best path forward not just for Wisconsin but for all of FRC.

[Sunshine]

Actually yes. We have been to IRI and my thoughts were exactly what I write here. Wasn't impressed with the facilities at all.

If I'm inviting a potential sponsor for my team to an event or the regional planning team invites someone with deep pockets to an event; you can't tell me that they'd be more impressed with a gym than an arena.

And there is just something special for our students to be compete on/in a professional sports facility.

For us, when we seek sponsorship or district support, explaining that we are competing with teams from several states and different countries has merit and influence. That goes away for the most part with districts.

Again, those on the fence about going to districts should search previous threads here on CD. You'll discover that feelings are closely split by those who are in districts. Don't take Eric's or my word for it. Do your homework and be knowledgable about the pros and cons.

I think it's enevitable that the district model becomes the norm. But it doesn't mean I and others will like it or endorse it. Talking with district planning folks I get the opinion that those who agree with me are vacating their roles for the most part. And those sticking around are in favor of districts. I'm not saying their involvement or lack of is dictated by this possible decision. But to me, I think there will be a majority on that committee in favor. Let your thoughts be known to that committee and the EAB if you have a strong opinion.

Eric, it's hard for me to accept your argument that 857 was only successful because of the change to districts. We both know team leadership, positive direction and focus plays into team success.

[Bruceb]

Originally Posted by EricLeifermann

Have you competed in a district competition or even been to one? What about IRI? Do you feel that event is less because its in a gym?

I thought the same things back in 2009 when Michigan 1st went to districts. I even fought heavily against it, though my reasons were more financial than playing in HS gyms.

I can say with 1st hand knowledge that competing in a gym does not take away from the experience one bit.

I can also say that districts help growth. Both on the amount of teams, but more importantly on the quality of teams.

Thanks to districts team 857, which I mentored in college, has flourished. They were a perennial one and done team occasionally going to Champs through signing up(when that was still an option) not earning it. They have earned it the last 2 years now and have won district EI twice I think, as well as being an alliance captain at champs this last year, and several district finalists, and other judged awards.

I have yet to experience a negative with districts. It is the best path forward not just for Wisconsin but for all of FRC.

First let me admit that I don't know anything about district events. One of the things my team always looks forward to in going to a regional is playing with teams from around the country and around the world. We have played with teams from pretty much every state, Canada, Isreal, Brazil, Mexico, Turkey, China and Australia. How does that shake out in a district model?

[EricLeifermann]

Originally Posted by Sunshine

Eric, it's hard for me to accept your argument that 857 was only successful because of the change to districts. We both know team leadership, positive direction and focus plays into team success.

Team 857 is/was ran by college students. The only consistent leadership the team has/had was the high school faculty member, and he does/did very little in regards to the direction the team went.

Each year the team would have a new college student leader, and the team would be run a little bit different. So yes I would say that districts is a huge reason 857 is have the success they are seeing the since 2009. Being able to compete 2-4 times (DCMP and CMP) add a ton of time for the team to interact and learn from other teams. Especially the amazing teams in MI. 857 used to only go to the Wisconsin regional and then go home. Not once in the years I was on the team did we win an award or go to elims at Wisconsin.

Originally Posted by Bruceb

First let me admit that I don't know anything about district events. One of the things my team always looks forward to in going to a regional is playing with teams from around the country and around the world. We have played with teams from pretty much every state, Canada, Isreal, Brazil, Mexico, Turkey, China and Australia. How does that shake out in a district model?

Team are still able to go to traditional regionals, there is also inter district play as well, and might I add Im pretty sure the interdistrict price tag is MUCH cheaper than going to a traditional regional as well.

Look at 125 thanks to districts they go to 4-5 comps before they even get to DCMP or CMP. The entrance price tag for teams to go to 4 or 5 comps for traditional regionals is $17,000-$21,000 in the district model its closer to 6,000 -8,000 depending on which price tag the district has for additional competitions (500 or 1000). Now add actual travel costs to that and its unattainable for 99% of teams.

You want inspiration and excitement for your kids, get them to more competitions.

Districts are also run Fri-Sat or Sat-Sun so mentors have to take less vacation and students miss less schools.

[Ernst]

Originally Posted by Bruceb

First let me admit that I don't know anything about district events. One of the things my team always looks forward to in going to a regional is playing with teams from around the country and around the world. We have played with teams from pretty much every state, Canada, Isreal, Brazil, Mexico, Turkey, China and Australia. How does that shake out in a district model?

In a District model you play 2 small events, usually in high school gyms, to rack up points from wins, awards, being an alliance captain, etc. The top teams by points qualify for District Champs, where points double. Districts are given a number of Champs spots based on their percentage of the FIRST population, so at about 20% of teams qualifying, WI would get around 10 spots this year, or 13 or 14 after Champs splits. Teams then qualify to CMP from DCMP by points and earning other DCMP awards, like Chairman's or EI.

Like Eric said, you're welcome to compete out of state and qualify for Champs by winning a Regional. But, for teams like 706, Districts would virtually guarantee a trip to Champs every year, where you can see many more international teams. The big difference with Districts, and one of my favorite parts of the system, is that more of the perennial Finalists and consistent alliance captains and first picks make it, not just teams good and lucky enough to win a Regional.

Originally Posted by Sunshine

Actually yes. We have been to IRI and my thoughts were exactly what I write here. Wasn't impressed with the facilities at all.

If I'm inviting a potential sponsor for my team to an event or the regional planning team invites someone with deep pockets to an event; you can't tell me that they'd be more impressed with a gym than an arena.

And there is just something special for our students to be compete on/in a professional sports facility.

I haven't been to a District event, but I've been to small off-season events and 40 team Regionals like Central Illinois and Boilermaker (RIP). As awe-inspiring as competing in a big arena is, I really like small venues. You're closer to the field, closer to other teams in the stands, and I think the energy levels feel a lot higher. You can hear and feel every impact on the field. The pits are a 30 second walk from the stands. And, with more, smaller events, more teams have a "home" event that they don't have to stay at hotels for. I can't speak for the sponsors, but I think having more local events and still having a big, premier event would be a way to bring in even more sponsors.

[Ginger Power]

Originally Posted by Sunshine

And there is just something special for our students to be compete on/in a professional sports facility.

This is exactly my argument for districts. If FIRST is trying to be a varsity sport for the mind, why not emulate successful varsity sports? Every varsity sport that I know of competes in high schools. Makes sense. The good teams earn their way to the regional and state championships. Those championship events are hosted in big arenas. As a little kid it was my dream to play varsity football on the floor of the Metrodome. If I automatically qualified to play at the Metrodome, it wouldn't have been special, or something to aspire to. Same goes for Regionals/Districts. If I automatically qualify to play on a grand stage it's not that special (Regionals). If I earn my way there through perseverance and hard work, it's truly special and something that I'll remember as a great achievement (Districts).

Hosting events in high school gyms also makes FRC more accessible for the public. Do you think Joe Shmoe from my hometown is more likely to drive 60-100 miles to watch my team in a glorious stadium, or drive 3-5 miles to my high school gym? If Joe Shmoe sees what's going in his hometown, and realizes how special FRC is, maybe he'll decide to get involved. Maybe he owns Company XYZ and decides to sponsor FRC teams in the future. Maybe Joe wants to mentor next year, or show his friends. Certainly none of this happens if we don't play in a high school gym. It definitely doesn't happen if we're going to some far away stadium and Joe has no idea we even exist.

[GBilletdeaux930]

Originally Posted by ZehP

I'm a bit worried that a lot of WI teams currently only do one event. This year 22 of WI's 48 teams are only attending one Regional. Several more are doing just that and Champs. Adding another 2 events in between to make it to Champs seems like a lot to ask for teams with less funding, but the state grants should help alleviate some of that. And hey, other regions have solved all of these problems already.

I'm going to summarize cost breakdowns found here.

District teams in all districts get 2 events with their registration fee. Immediately more bang for your buck (for non-rookie teams, $5,000 vs $9,000). If they make it to the State Championship Event (which, by the way, has more ring to it and prestige than "Wisconsin Regional" when talking to sponsors), that's $4,000. So now we're at 3 district events for the cost of 2 regionals.

If you want to go to a 3rd district event before the State Championships, you're in luck! It's $1,000 in most districts, $500 in FIM and MAR. So 4 events for $10,000 vs 4 events for $17,000. Minimum of 40 matches on your robot, assuming you don't make it to the elims.

Math is pretty simple. For rookie teams, add an additional $1,000 since their registration fee is more expensive. But if you want to get more FIRST experience for your money, districts are the way to go.

If a rookie team is receiving the WI Grant, it means they will already have $10,000 in funding between the Grant and other sponsors, which is enough to pay for 3 District events and the State Championship.

[Road Rash]

Originally Posted by BigJ

Twitch automatically mutes portions of the archive due to copyrighted audio.

That bothered me to no end when I decided to capture video of the qualification matches from my son's team. 3 of the matches had muted audio. Fortunately 1 of the 3 matches I had captured live, but missed the introductions. So I at least had that video.

I do understand copyright issues, but I wish the muting algorithm had a heart. At least Twitch muted only portions of the audio. The same feed archive is available on YouTube and the entire audio track was muted there.

[Bruceb]

so if you qualify for state based on district points accumulated is it somehow adjusted for the number of district events you attend? If not, it favors teams that can afford to attend more events.