Are 8 play regional reasonable?

[Ginger Power]

Originally Posted by BrendanB

Keep in mind these teams would have had the same issues if they were at districts and probably wouldn't have seen the field til later on Day 1. The first events of the years are typically the hardest and have a handful of teams who are in that same situation of working into qualifications to get inspected.

All you can do is educate teams on where they need to try to be walking in the door and give them some resources to succeed (send out the inspection sheet before bag day and encourage teams to run through it).

I suppose I have a different mindset. Minnesota Inspectors have the goal of getting every team inspected for their first match. Obviously this is so they can get the most out of the experience. In the district system they would have another full event that they would be ready for, even if they didn't pass inspection until near the end of quals... makes sense to me!

[PayneTrain]

Originally Posted by Ginger Power

I suppose I have a different mindset. Minnesota Inspectors have the goal of getting every team inspected for their first match. Obviously this is so they can get the most out of the experience. In the district system they would have another full event that they would be ready for, even if they didn't pass inspection until near the end of quals... makes sense to me!

If they happen to pass inspection before the end of Thursday in this scenario, they are already getting more out of the events than they are now.

[XaulZan11]

Originally Posted by Ginger Power

I suppose I have a different mindset. Minnesota Inspectors have the goal of getting every team inspected for their first match. Obviously this is so they can get the most out of the experience. In the district system they would have another full event that they would be ready for, even if they didn't pass inspection until near the end of quals... makes sense to me!

Even a team takes until Friday morning to get inspected and make their first match, they would still play in the current 8 matches/event. Everyone else would get the extra benefit of playing in the extra 3-4 matches. Even if everyone just goes to one event, this is probably better than the current system on a whole.

[BrendanB]

Originally Posted by Ginger Power

I suppose I have a different mindset. Minnesota Inspectors have the goal of getting every team inspected for their first match. Obviously this is so they can get the most out of the experience. In the district system they would have another full event that they would be ready for, even if they didn't pass inspection until near the end of quals... makes sense to me!

I wouldn't say its a different mindset. Our inspectors have that goal as well and I remember working hard with one team in 2014 to get them inspected by their second match (of their first event).

The scenario you are pointing to is valid however it is an extreme. If a team can't pass inspection at a district event with 6 hours of unbag time at their shop, 5 hours on load in night (Day 0 as we call it in Districts), and another 8 hours on Friday (or Day 1) that is a serious problem but it can't define a system that the other 59 teams are competing in it.

Would getting all teams inspected by 2pm on a Thursday (with 6 hours of unbag time) be a challenge. YES and you probably won't get every single team ready. Could it work as a solution to give regions that currently can't (or won't) move to districts for a long time the ability to give their teams more bang for their buck without adding more events. Yes.

[Jon Stratis]

Originally Posted by BrendanB

The scenario you are pointing to is valid however it is an extreme. If a team can't pass inspection at a district event with 6 hours of unbag time at their shop, 5 hours on load in night (Day 0 as we call it in Districts), and another 8 hours on Friday (or Day 1) that is a serious problem but it can't define a system that the other 59 teams are competing in it.

Going into a team's first event, they don't really have the 6 hours of unbag time to pass inspection - most of the time we find inspection issues that the team is completely unaware of - you can't fix what you don't know! It's something I (personally) and concerned with, and am trying to think about ways we could address it. Trust me, I haven't heard anyone use this as an excuse - I think everyone just assumes that I'll be able to make it work for us just like we have at our regionals for years

[Alan Anderson]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

He claimed a lack of ignorance why other events couldn't give 9+ (more than 8) plays for 60 teams (over a full event) when another event did 12 plays for 40 teams in one day.

I must have skipped over that part of the claim. What event did 80 matches in one day?

[dradel]

The part that I haven't seen anyone bring up yet is the fact that you get 2 events in the district model. So really you are getting in the area of 20-24 plays for the $5k. But then must pay more $$ to go to district champs, then more $$ if moving on to worlds

[PayneTrain]

Originally Posted by Jon Stratis

Going into a team's first event, they don't really have the 6 hours of unbag time to pass inspection - most of the time we find inspection issues that the team is completely unaware of - you can't fix what you don't know! It's something I (personally) and concerned with, and am trying to think about ways we could address it. Trust me, I haven't heard anyone use this as an excuse - I think everyone just assumes that I'll be able to make it work for us just like we have at our regionals for years

Would you consider having some sort of "inverse kickoff" where teams can bring their robots to be unbagged and inspected and adjusted at a large public location? It would be a great opportunity to bring together new and potential future key volunteers.

[maxnz]

Originally Posted by dradel

The part that I haven't seen anyone bring up yet is the fact that you get 2 events in the district model. So really you are getting in the area of 20-24 plays for the $5k. But then must pay more $$ to go to district champs, then more $$ if moving on to worlds

But the fact that you have more matches to fine-tune your robot before champs makes the price of the district events, DCMP and CMP (5K+4K+5K) much more worth it than paying for two regionals and CMP (5K+4K+5K).

[Andrew Schreiber]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

I must have skipped over that part of the claim. What event did 80 matches in one day?

Umass Dartmouth, due to concerns about weather on Sunday evening of the event we condensed the entire event to be done by 2pm Sunday. This meant that qualification matches were completed by Saturday night and alliance selection was right after opening ceremonies on Sunday. So, 80 matches in one day is certainly doable. You're telling me that doing the remaining 20 matches can't be done in the morning before eliminations?

[Joe Ross]

Originally Posted by Andrew Schreiber

Then only commit to 8. At least teams know what they are getting when they come to your event. But if UMD can run 12 matches for 40 teams in a single day I don't have a ton of understanding why your guys can't run more than 8 matches. Work volunteers in shifts to lighten the load.

Assuming that UMD means UMass Dartmouth, that event wasn't 40 teams, it was 32. They ran 64 matches on Saturday. 10000 Lakes ran 70 matches on Friday.

[dradel]

No one says you have to do two regionals. I mean if you win at a regional your in for champs. If you win say Chairmans at a regional you are in as well. Our first year we won rookie all star at the one regional we went to, and then went on to worlds.

[dag0620]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

I must have skipped over that part of the claim. What event did 80 matches in one day?

Andrew was referring to the 2016 UMass District Event, where all of qualification matches were ran on Day 1 due to impending weather later Day 2.

I want to clarify however that event only had 32 teams at 64 qualification matches, not the 40 and 80 as everyone has been discussing.

On another note, while yes we did it in one day, we cut things out of the schedule, and played through meals, which isn't ideal. It was worth it to get everyone home safe, but I wouldn't make it the norm.

[Andrew Schreiber]

Originally Posted by Joe Ross

Assuming that UMD means UMass Dartmouth, that event wasn't 40 teams, it was 32. They ran 64 matches on Saturday. 10000 Lakes ran 70 matches on Friday.

You're right, I forgot that I'm not in MI where every event is full. However, the fact that 10k lakes ran 70 matches Friday almost proves my point of, we can do better than 8 matches a team.


Ok, let me put this very bluntly - 8 match events is terrible for team experience, it's a borderline offensive to see all these folks "oh we can't do any more" and that's acceptable. I'm tired of skirting around the issue - Jon, Doug, Alan, if you don't CARE that the teams are getting jack for their money fine. But at least advertise the fact that your events don't care about team experience. Or try to come up with some ideas on how to make it better for them that aren't "it's hard".

[interpretTHIS]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

I must have skipped over that part of the claim. What event did 80 matches in one day?

The closest that I've been able to find was this 2011 event in Hartford, CT, which played 72 matches on Friday:
http://www2.usfirst.org/2011comp/eve...chresults.html

However, they had one of the most capable FTAs in all of FRC; running 5 or 6 minute turns with some 4s mixed in is not typical nor can be expected across the board.