Best FIRST Game EVER?

[BenHildy]

Originally Posted by Taylor

Why is FIRST Stronghold not on the poll?

The poll was created after the first 15 comments or so, and no one had ranked it as high. Sorry about that.

[Chris is me]

It will be very, very hard for a game to top 2013's Ultimate Ascent - the game had the perfect mix of difficult design constraints, strategic diversity, offensive protection, defensive strategy, and possibilities for iteration. There was basically no robot that year that truly mastered every single game task - you absolutely had to compromise on at least some portion of the game (and the less compromising you did, the more you risked sacrificing effectiveness in some aspect of the game). If we played the game again, we still wouldn't know what the "right" design was - nothing was unbeatable.

2012 and 2016 are, of the games I've played, those closest to 2013 in quality. 2012 was almost as good, but ultimately annoyances with ball variation and the coopertition bridge make it a smidge worse than 2013, plus there was a bit less diversity in design. The 2016 game is very, very good - perhaps time will tell that it is up there with 2013 among the best games ever. I'm very happy with it, but it remains to be seen just how much strategic depth it has.

[Ben Martin]

Ultimate Ascent. Points were balanced, the floor was relatively low for shooting a frisbee, games were fast-paced and exciting, and the field geometry and rules forced diversity in robot designs and distinct roles at the highest level of play. You couldn't build a robot that would be the absolute best at every task. Defense and counter-defense strategies were important for both protecting and shutting down full-court shooters. The potential was there for big point swings based on changes in one's strategy. Game piece variability was also far less of a factor than it has ever been for a shooting game. Rankings and the eliminations play structure were simple.

Also, the most competitive off-season event made zero rule changes (aside from giving +5 lb and switching to 1-8, 1-8, 8-1 alliance selection), which I think speaks to the strength of the original game.

[dirtbikerxz]

Why are we not talking about Stronghold? Is this legacy games only?

[George A.]

I'm almost certain that this will be an unpopular opinion, (and forgive me if it was only supposed to be from those choices listed) but my favorite game so far has to be Triple Play for the sheer strategy involved.

It was the first game to introduce alliances of 3 which completely threw us for a loop, tetras were the most unique object we had to deal with (and arguably the most unique ever) and there were 18 places to score! (on top of 9 goals under 9 goals)

Given the scoring nature of the game each tetra placed could literally have a 40 point swing in the scores. Working with your partners to get in a rhythm and work on who would place a tetra when and where they would place it was crucial as if there was a backup it could be devastating to your alliance.

[BenHildy]

Originally Posted by George A.

I'm almost certain that this will be an unpopular opinion, (and forgive me if it was only supposed to be from those choices listed) but my favorite game so far has to be Triple Play for the sheer strategy involved.

It was the first game to introduce alliances of 3 which completely threw us for a loop, tetras were the most unique object we had to deal with (and arguably the most unique ever) and there were 18 places to score! (on top of 9 goals under 9 goals)

Given the scoring nature of the game each tetra placed could literally have a 40 point swing in the scores. Working with your partners to get in a rhythm and work on who would place a tetra when and where they would place it was crucial as if there was a backup it could be devastating to your alliance.

There is not rule about which you can post about, again sorry for the low amount of options on the poll, so don't fret! I like your opinion here, as Triple Play has always held a certain place in my heart. The game itself was so strange and new that it's reception was very diverse. Some hated it and some loved it. It's good to see its positive presence here!

[Peyton Yeung]

Originally Posted by George A.

I'm almost certain that this will be an unpopular opinion, (and forgive me if it was only supposed to be from those choices listed) but my favorite game so far has to be Triple Play for the sheer strategy involved.

It was the first game to introduce alliances of 3 which completely threw us for a loop, tetras were the most unique object we had to deal with (and arguably the most unique ever) and there were 18 places to score! (on top of 9 goals under 9 goals)

Given the scoring nature of the game each tetra placed could literally have a 40 point swing in the scores. Working with your partners to get in a rhythm and work on who would place a tetra when and where they would place it was crucial as if there was a backup it could be devastating to your alliance.

What i think is interesting about 2005 was that from a strategic stand point it is a constant game of chess, every action you make is countered by your opponent and it becomes a game of thinking a few moves ahead.

[pandamonium]

Originally Posted by Peyton Yeung

What i think is interesting about 2005 was that from a strategic stand point it is a constant game of chess, every action you make is countered by your opponent and it becomes a game of thinking a few moves ahead.

2005 and 2007 had really complex strategies but from a coaching perspective stronghold is incredibly difficult and fun to coach.

[Peyton Yeung]

Originally Posted by pandamonium

2005 and 2007 had really complex strategies but from a coaching perspective stronghold is incredibly difficult and fun to coach.

Last year was so much easier for me to coach. The drivers were practically on autopilot each match.

[BenHildy]

Originally Posted by Peyton Yeung

Last year was so much easier for me to coach. The drivers were practically on autopilot each match.

That's what I personally didn't like last year. With no robot interference from the other alliance (besides noodle throwing), the robots did the exact same thing every single match with very little variation of strategy on the spot, which I believe is a major part of FRC.

[Zebra_Fact_Man]

Looking at the scores from the 2003 World finals posted in another thread got me thinking; why haven't there been more games where de-scoring played a factor?

From my limited memory:
2002 score was dynamic until the end, depending on where the goals/balls/robots were. Moving goals out of the opposing team's scoring area would effectively de-score them.
2003 containers could be removed from the scoring area.
2007 Spoiler tubes could be hung to de-score the opposing alliance's tube/chain.

That's about all I can remember. Would be so awesome if score worked both ways again, instead of just up. Kind of don't like additive penalties for the same reason. It makes the other alliance look better, rather than yours look worse.

[Citrus Dad]

I have to wait until after Champs to decide.

[Charles Boehm]

My top two:

2013 - Ultimate Ascent
Maybe it's just because it was my rookie year but this game will always hold a special place in my heart. Very fun game piece and easy and fun to watch from the stands. There was something really satisfying about watching disc after disc hit that high goal.

2014 - Aerial Assist
While a lot of people I think would argue that the insane amount of defense really took away from this game, I think this still was one of the most exciting games to see develop over time. My favorite thing was to see all of the new and awesome ways people came up with to pass balls. "Secret Sauce" for example.

Perhaps it's because I'm on the drive team and get to literally play the game this year, but FIRST Stronghold might just top my list when we are through with it.

[BenHildy]

Originally Posted by Charles Boehm

2014 - Aerial Assist
While a lot of people I think would argue that the insane amount of defense really took away from this game, I think this still was one of the most exciting games to see develop over time. My favorite thing was to see all of the new and awesome ways people came up with to pass balls. "Secret Sauce" for example.

I would agree with you here, that the complex offensive strategies brought forth by Aerial Assist truly developed a new feel to the game that we'd never really seen before. The idea that a human player could have so much impact on the game was kind of unheard of, at least since the early 2000's. Also, I didn't mind the ungodly defense, as it brought a new level of evasive maneuvers and shot precision to the drive teams. Plus, gotta love that bank shot from 254's human player...

[Bob Steele]

Originally Posted by MooreteP

Agree with you here. Especially FIRST Frenzy. The first Autonomous.

Actually the first game with autonomous was Stack Attack if I remember correctly....:0)

Note: I am NOT advocating for that game as the best ever... NOOOO!