Texas UIL State Championship Qualification Information

[lynca]

Originally Posted by Jrizo

It makes me extremely sad that we will not be able to attend TRR this year.

Many teams will not be invited to TRR this year.
There are more Texas Offseason competitions

1. TRI - Houston
2. Robot Remix - Woodlands
3. Robot Reboot - Fort Worth
4. Red Stick Rumble - Louisiana

Sign up for as many off-seasons as you can, every event makes your team better.

[AllenGregoryIV]

Originally Posted by lynca

3. Robot Reboot - Fort Worth

I've been told Reboot isn't happening this year by 4206. If anyone hears different please post about it.

[Jrizo]

Originally Posted by lynca

Many teams will not be invited to TRR this year.
There are more Texas Offseason competitions

1. TRI - Houston
2. Robot Remix - Woodlands
3. Robot Reboot - Fort Worth
4. Red Stick Rumble - Louisiana

Sign up for as many off-seasons as you can, every event makes your team better.

All of these require an overnight stay for our team TRR is a short drive from Waco

[Mr.Frishman]

Joe-
What is precluding The Metallic Clouds from applying for one of the slots? This is only a temporary thing for this year. 10 teams like ours will be at the event.
-Leigh

[FBHS_Robotics]

I will preface this by saying that I am not affiliated with any FRC team. I am an FTC guy. By their very nature the two have very different issues as it relates to UIL. I understand the discussions that have been going back and forth about mixed teams, non school teams, etc. There is a lot of discussion about the exclusion of home school kids, private school kids, etc. While it might not be "fair" that is how UIL works. In addition to robotics, I am the sponsor for our UIL Computer Science team. If a home school student comes to me and shows a love for learning programming and wants to be a part of the team, I have to tell them no. That's how it works and it won't change.

If TAPPS wanted to start a robotics competition, I doubt they would let the public schools join them. That is how it works. By choosing to be a home school student or a going to a private school, a student gives us their right to compete in events sponsored by organization focused on public schools.

Now with that said, I will transition to the FTC issue I see and I ask for feedback/discussion. In UIL every other team competition, only one team per school is allowed to compete. However, for UIL robotics, there is no limit on how many teams from one school can compete if more than one school meets the requirements. Back to my Comp. Sci. analogy. A CS team is made up of 3 students....If I have students and can make the best 2 CS teams around, I can still only send one to UIL Competitions. Why is robotics being handles differently? If the intent is to promote robotics and increase participation, how is allowing a school to send 5 or 6 teams going to do that. It won't. And before any of my colleagues play the "if you want to go get better card", let me again go to every other UIL event. Multiple teams from one school are not allowed to compete. If a school could field 2 state champion level debate teams, they can't send them. If a school sends multiple teams to invitational and/or practice meets and they win every award, they still can't send them to even a district level event. One team per school is the rule for every other team UIL event. Why should robotics be any different? UIL is using the FTC game for his state event, they should limit participation to one team per school. If a school has 7 or 8 high caliber teams, they can advance through the normal FTC process and go to Worlds. Taking teams that have already advanced to Worlds and saying those are the teams get to compete for the UIL State Championship is, imo, unfair to other UIL schools that have programs and weren't able to advance.

Ok, climbing off of my soapbox for now.

[Michael Blake]

Originally Posted by FBHS_Robotics

If TAPPS wanted to start a robotics competition, I doubt they would let the public schools join them. That is how it works.

It's my understanding, I'm a transplant from Long Island, TAPPS was formed as a _reaction_ to the exclusionary dogma and territory avarice of UIL Texas.

http://tapps.biz/

--Michael Blake

[FBHS_Robotics]

Originally Posted by Michael Blake

It's my understanding, I'm a transplant from Long Island, TAPPS was formed as a _reaction_ to the exclusionary dogma and territory avarice of UIL Texas.

http://tapps.biz/

--Michael Blake

Maybe, but they don't let public schools or public school students compete. There is no difference between what they do and what UIL does.

[Michael Blake]

Originally Posted by FBHS_Robotics

That is how it works. By choosing to be a home school student or a going to a private school, a student gives us their right to compete in events sponsored by organization focused on public schools.

I just don't understand that statement IF it's about the students.

However, FIRST-in-Texas _did not_ have to do a deal with UIL that has an unimpeachable negative and exclusionary impact on some present and future students.

--Michael Blake

[Mr.Frishman]

After multiple conversations with some of the people involved in that decision to go UIL I honestly believe that they made the decision based on what would be good for the majority of the teams in Texas. I have gone to great lengths to explain to my team that UIL will in no way affect what we do in FIRST. We can still participate(and win) in either Regionals or Districts(when we go that route). 3999's history is based on the fact that we did not want to be constrained by our district rules about who could be a member. If your district is going to enforce URL rules and they dont suit you, maybe its time to go independent?

[Michael Blake]

Let me add... NOBODY here is bad guy/gal.

I believe everyone involved has good intentions and are good people--some I really like individually.

I just don't agree with the goals of FIRST-in-Texas and their approaches and their insularity from real team leaders, like myself, who try to get involved with FiT and offer to contribute and to help shape goals and approaches and are rebuffed from getting involved, because we're not in the club, where the rubber hits the road.

Has anyone looked lately at the FIRST-in-Texas board roster? WHERE'S the experienced experts on running FIRST FRC and FTC teams?

ALL accomplished folks on the board, for sure, but _how_ would they know what we teams need and want in Texas competition robotics?

And you can see the actual fruits of this experience gap in the UIL deal as it's now constituted.

--Michael Blake

[Coach Norm]

Originally Posted by Michael Blake

Let me add... NOBODY here is bad guy/gal.

Has anyone looked lately at the FIRST-in-Texas board roster? WHERE'S the experienced experts on running FIRST FRC and FTC teams?

ALL accomplished folks on the board, for sure, but _how_ would they know what we teams need and want in Texas competition robotics?

--Michael Blake

I know for a fact that two of the FiT board members have experience mentoring both FLL and FTC teams. And one of them has participated as an FRC mentor as well. I also know that two others on the board are very active in organizing FIRST Robotics activities through their employer and have participated in a variety of FIRST related contests throughout the past. I believe the board of FiT is working toward improving robotics for all students in Texas. As the district model comes to Texas, finances to pay for the increased number of tournaments is a big factor. I have had conversations with no less than five of the board members.

UIL does not have any consequences on official FIRST activities.

I do not see now FIRST in Texas sees the lure of extra finances from increased number of teams. No money goes to FIRST in Texas in regards to an increased number of teams in Texas.

I am at a school district that does not allow students outside of my school to participate in our robotics program. I know there are FRC teams that do allow this. I am losing a student this year who is moving to a private school that does not have robotics. I cannot do anything about the situation except to help him impress on the administration at his new school on the impact robotics can have on students, find him a team he can participate on or help him start on a new team of some sort. We shall see what happens in the upcoming months on his plight.

UIL is the one who has chosen to recognize robotics as an activity and chosen BEST and FIRST as the ones to work with in the pilot. I for one was against UIL recognizing only one or two and not more. This year is a pilot program. As Jess said, this is the only year TRR will be impacted. UIL recognizing and promoting robotics is a good thing for all of us. It gives more credibility and raises the awareness.

I also believe that the conversation started higher up than FIRST in Texas and UIL. FIRST Headquarters have been involved in this conversation for a good while.

The meeting with UIL in Austin was not open to the public so many teams and individuals could not participate in the meetings with UIL. Even earlier than the planning meeting was the Executive Council meeting in October of 2014. Many active users here on CD were present as well representatives from multiple robotics programs. Robotics had more individuals speak about the importance of STEM and Robotics. Each made different points and different opinions. What was very apparent was the shock and surprise from the UIL Executive Council not only in the interest in robotics but also in the many different programs that were out there.

[Michael Blake]

Originally Posted by Coach Norm

I do not see now FIRST in Texas sees the lure of extra finances from increased number of teams. No money goes to FIRST in Texas in regards to an increased number of teams in Texas.

Norman... doesn't _ALL_ the money go to FIRST-in-Texas when they convert to DISTRICT MODEL? Team registration fees and Texas sponsor dollars ALL go to FiT when District Model?

And then FiT pays an annual fee to USFIRST, similar to a franchise fee?

--Michael Blake

[Coach Norm]

Originally Posted by Michael Blake

Norman... doesn't _ALL_ the money go to FIRST-in-Texas when they convert to DISTRICT MODEL? Team registration fees and Texas sponsor dollars ALL go to FiT when District Model?

And then FiT pays an annual fee to USFIRST, similar to a franchise fee?

--Michael Blake

All money paid by a first team for registration passes along to FIRST HQ. It does not stay with FiT. I do not understand how that benefits FiT.

[Michael Blake]

Originally Posted by Coach Norm

All money paid by a first team for registration passes along to FIRST HQ. It does not stay with FiT. I do not understand how that benefits FiT.

Norman... I asked _when_ we convert to _DISTRICT MODEL_... which should happen next season or the next after that at the latest, doesn't ALL the money from the FRC team registration fees and Texas FRC sponsors get paid to and remain with FIRST-in-Texas to operate itself and the competitions minus an annual fee FiT pays to USFIRST as a "franchise/license" fee?

I could be wrong on this, but I'm going on what I've been told by those who should know...

--Michael Blake

[Knufire]

Originally Posted by Michael Blake

Norman... I asked _when_ we convert to _DISTRICT MODEL_... which should happen next season or the next after that at the latest, doesn't ALL the money from the FRC team registration fees and Texas FRC sponsors get paid to and remain with FIRST-in-Texas to operate itself and the competitions minus an annual fee FiT pays to USFIRST as a "franchise/license" fee?

I could be wrong on this, but I'm going on what I've been told by those who should know...

--Michael Blake

In most district models, the $5000 registration fees by teams goes straight to FIRST HQ. $1000/team is then regranted from FIRST HQ back to the district organization.

PNW pioneered a new funding model this past year for several reasons, but even in the PNW model, the same amount of money is sent to FIRST HQ. What you are suggesting sounds similar to the PNW model, and it is possible that FiT is trying to adopt this funding model right away. More information about this model can be found here: http://pnwfirst.org/wp/files/Funding...-Northwest.pdf

When someone (in or out of state) wants to play an addition district event, that $1000 registration fee goes directly towards the district organization.