Championship Waitlist

[Joe Johnson]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

894 dropped out earlier so since there hasn't been another invite, the roster is still at 599 and 1 opening if 272 accepts.

I swear at this point HQ should add 3 teams and whoever confirms first gets it. It'll hurt the 2 that are too slow, but the time it takes for a team to confirm is pushing the process out too long. Either that or they cut it at 599 and that's it. It's not like anyone but a local team is going to pull off a Champs trip all on Monday.

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

I don't speak for 246, but I can speak for my own experience as a mentor on a team that was on the bubble. FIRST has been completely opaque. We've gotten basically no explanation of the process or how things would work or when we would know something or not.

Part of our team is convinced that a mistake was made and that we should have been invited based on our rank at the end of the NEF-DCMP. We brought it up with NEF folks only to be told it is out of their hands. We have brought it up with FIRST. No answer. Not a yes, not a no, nothing. When we finally called to get to a live body they didn't seem interested in hearing the argument yet alone explaining why we were mistaken. All they could say was that it is done by an algorithm and they don't explain their algorithms to teams. Repeated request for more info resulted in no response whatever.

Earlier in the week, when some seniors where getting worked up about a potential mistake being made, I assured my team that they'd be treated fairly. I can't say that now. Maybe they were treated fairly. Maybe they were cheated out of an invite to St. Louis. Who can say? It is done by Algorithm and FIRST doesn't explain its Algorithms to teams.

I believe that FIRST owes the community more transparency (any transparency would an improvement). One quote I heard from another mentor, "FIRST is a black box about their CMP list. They make their decisions and explain nothing."

I'll close as I started: FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

Dr. Joe J.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by Joe Johnson

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

I don't speak for 246, but I can speak for my own experience as a mentor on a team that was on the bubble. FIRST has been completely opaque. We've gotten basically no explanation of the process or how things would work or when we would know something or not.

Part of our team is convinced that a mistake was made and that we should have been invited based on our rank at the end of the NEF-DCMP. We brought it up with NEF folks only to be told it is out of their hands. We have brought it up with FIRST. No answer. Not a yes, not a no, nothing. When we finally called to get to a live body they didn't seem interested in hearing the argument yet alone explaining why we were mistaken. All they could say was that it is done by an algorithm and they don't explain their algorithms to teams. Repeated request for more info resulted in no response whatever.

Earlier in the week, when some seniors where getting worked up about a potential mistake being made, I assured my team that they'd be treated fairly. I can't say that now. Maybe they were treated fairly. Maybe they were cheated out of an invite to St. Louis. Who can say? It is done by Algorithm and FIRST doesn't explain its Algorithms to teams.

I believe that FIRST owes the community more transparency (any transparency would an improvement). One quote I heard from another mentor, "FIRST is a black box about their CMP list. They make their decisions and explain nothing."

I'll close as I started: FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

Dr. Joe J.

I would hope the announcement about 2Champz will clarify some things like this whenever they get around to making it. I was assuming there would be an announcement or town hall about it at Champs, but I don't see one on the schedule. If there's a surprise town hall, I'd be willing to be an advocate on this for teams that feel slighted or in the dark about the current selection process, as would others on here, I'm sure. I'd need a crash course in district advancement and why your team thinks they should've gotten an invite, however, since I've been in Regional-ville for my whole career.

[rich2202]

Originally Posted by Joe Johnson

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year. ...

You would think by Monday after the last weekend of competition, FIRST could publish a list of the order of the teams to be invited.

Teams could then figure out their likelihood of clearing the waitlist, and watch the acceptances/declines. Teams could even pre-decline.

[Sperkowsky]

Call me crazy but the admin manual mentions nothing about First being allowed to specially invite local teams off the waitlist. I understand the idea but then there should be something in writing.

I wish the waitlist process was just entirely more open and know. It's this weird hidden thing throughout manual and everything about it seems vague.

But all in all its better then nothing. My team may not have gotten invited this year but we will either make it next year or have 8 entries and hope for the best.

[Joe Johnson]

Originally Posted by Joe Johnson

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

I don't speak for 246, but I can speak for my own experience as a mentor on a team that was on the bubble. FIRST has been completely opaque. We've gotten basically no explanation of the process or how things would work or when we would know something or not.

Part of our team is convinced that a mistake was made and that we should have been invited based on our rank at the end of the NEF-DCMP. We brought it up with NEF folks only to be told it is out of their hands. We have brought it up with FIRST. No answer. Not a yes, not a no, nothing. When we finally called to get to a live body they didn't seem interested in hearing the argument yet alone explaining why we were mistaken. All they could say was that it is done by an algorithm and they don't explain their algorithms to teams. Repeated request for more info resulted in no response whatever.

Earlier in the week, when some seniors where getting worked up about a potential mistake being made, I assured my team that they'd be treated fairly. I can't say that now. Maybe they were treated fairly. Maybe they were cheated out of an invite to St. Louis. Who can say? It is done by Algorithm and FIRST doesn't explain its Algorithms to teams.

I believe that FIRST owes the community more transparency (any transparency would an improvement). One quote I heard from another mentor, "FIRST is a black box about their CMP list. They make their decisions and explain nothing."

I'll close as I started: FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

Dr. Joe J.

For what it is worth, someone NE FIRST finally sent me a table with some data that has convinced me that we were treated fairly, there was not a mistake in the invitation list at least as far as our team is concerned. So... that's good.

Still doesn't clear up the issues of transparency and timely responses but at least I did get something to reassure the team that a mistake didn't keep them from St. Louis.

FWIW.

Dr. Joe J.