Wisconsin District Rankings

[Mastonevich]

I would think the La Crosse Center would make a pretty good venue for a regional. If I remember right there is some convention space right next to the arena that would make a good pit area. If you went to districts, where would you have it at? Either Central or Logan?

I'm impressed with the rookie showings in the district rankings.

[EricLeifermann]

A very dedicated and driven group has formed to create a proposal and move Wisconsin to districts. It is our goal to have this happen by 2018.

Originally Posted by rich2202

Makes it tough on teams that are on the WI side of Minneapolis and Duluth.

Maybe we just have to define the district carefully to exclude the NW corner of the State.

I can see playing in another regional. You have the chance of advancing.

What's the point in playing in another district if you don't get points? I guess if that District is week 1, then you get some practice before your Districts matches that count.

When Michigan went to districts in 2009, it made ZERO sense for the UP teams as they all traveled 8 hours to get to the Wisconsin regional, districts forced them to drive 8+ hours twice to the LP to compete. Look up some of my posts from 2009 I fought it hard. But I can tell you that districts has made the teams in the UP better, and now there are 2 events in the UP.

Originally Posted by the_godfaubel

Any movement to bring an event to Madison? When I'm at school, I don't get to help out as much as I'd like. Bringing an event to Madison (Alliant Energy Center or possibly Kohl Center) would be great. It also might give those teams on the west side of the state a nicer journey for their second event.

Madison is on the list of potential sites in the future. A member of the group has just moved to Madison from Michigan and what he did in Michigan is help grow teams and track that growth. He is going to be a great asset to the Madison area and Wisconsin as a whole. I am looking forward to working with him.

Edit: I will add that the 2 venues you suggested would not be used as a district event location unless the venue was donated. The point of districts is to lower the cost of the events both for the teams as well as running the event.

With the budget of the current Wisconsin Regional we could run 3 district events and a state championship, and the quality of those events wouldn't really suffer compared to what you get at a traditional regionals.

[EricLeifermann]

Originally Posted by rich2202

Makes it tough on teams that are on the WI side of Minneapolis and Duluth.

Maybe we just have to define the district carefully to exclude the NW corner of the State.

I can see playing in another regional. You have the chance of advancing.

What's the point in playing in another district if you don't get points? I guess if that District is week 1, then you get some practice before your Districts matches that count.

That 3rd district is only $500-$1000(depending on which district you play in) instead of $4000, and you get 12 qual matches. Its a much better value. And again nothing is stoping a team from going to a traditional regional as well. Many teams in districts do this.

[notmattlythgoe]

Originally Posted by EricLeifermann

Teams in districts are free to pay and play in other districts or regionals. Points are not accumulated for playing in another district(for now) or a traditional regional.

The topic of official inter-district play is being brought up at the district meeting this week. Hopefully this is something that can be changed.

[rich2202]

Regarding Venue:

A lot of Districts are held in High School Field Houses. Brookfield East, Brookfield, WI, has a nice new field house, that could possibly be used.

It seems like most Districts are Friday/Saturday. I'm not sure if WI schools are ready to give up their Field Houses on a Friday when school is in session. So, Sat/Sun events with setup Friday afternoon-evening?

Where would the WI Championship be played? If at the UWM Panther Arena, wouldn't that be the same cost as a regional? 2nd venue in the Milwaukee area? Or, same as the 1st venue?

[rich2202]

Regarding Staffing:

To run 3 events, the Distrcit will need a major step-up in volunteers, especially in key positions. I could see 3 Head Refs, and 3 Lead Robot Inspectors rotating between the 3 District Events (they would be regular refs, and regular robot inspectors when they are not the head/lead).

Other positions (Announcers, FTA, CSA, Scorekeepers, etc.) are just as important, but don't need as many per event as you need Ref's and RI's.

[Kevin Kolodziej]

I'm glad to see a lot of people talking about and interested in this topic. My quest began after 2015 Wisconsin Regional and Eric has picked up where I have been unable to.

Ideally, I could see the state championship rotating between UW locations - Milwaukee has the Klotsche Center, Oshkosh has the Kolf Center Fieldhouse, and I'm sure the other UW schools have suitable locations as well. Rental rates for those two arenas aren't bad at all, and if we can get the schools on board to donate, then it is even better.

Bradley Tech in Milwaukee would be suitable for a district event as well, but parking is a bit of a problem (no main lot, all street parking).

As much as I would love to see the state split and half go with IL and half go with MN, it just isn't going to happen. It's not a perfect solution for all teams - some of those remote teams that only go to one MN event would now likely have to travel two or three times to play in other parts of WI. Teams that current travel to a second regional could see savings for 2 districts + DCMP, depending on if they need to stay overnight for the second district or the DCMP (putting a district event in Oshkosh/Appleton, Milwaukee, and La Crosse puts two districts within 60 miles of all but a few teams).

Current 2 regional team costs:
$5000 first event
$4000 second event
$3500 travel to non local event (bus for 4 days)
$3000 hotel for non local event (3 nights)
Total: $15500

Potential 2 district team costs:
$5000 for two district events
$2000 travel to non local district (bus for 3 days)
$2000 hotel for non local district (2 nights)
Total: $9000
$5000 for DCMP
$3000 travel to DCMP
$2000 travel to DCMP
Additional $10000 with far travel/lodging needed for DCMP

There are situations where the cost does go up*, but the possibility of having the district events on Saturday/Sunday makes me super happy so I actually have some vacation days left for, you know, vacation! And the kids don't have to miss so much school then. I will absolutely step up as a key volunteer for the event my team doesn't go to and will certainly help out where I can elsewhere. There are a lot of volunteers within the state that are less active than they used to be (myself included).

*Keep in mind that teams are eligible for the $5000 grant in the future, so that extra cost may be easy to overcome. I can only anticipate that growth will accelerate now because of the grant. We have over 300 FLL teams in the state right now - those kids are looking for FRC teams to join.

[EricLeifermann]

Originally Posted by rich2202

Regarding Venue:

A lot of Districts are held in High School Field Houses. Brookfield East, Brookfield, WI, has a nice new field house, that could possibly be used.

It seems like most Districts are Friday/Saturday. I'm not sure if WI schools are ready to give up their Field Houses on a Friday when school is in session. So, Sat/Sun events with setup Friday afternoon-evening?

Where would the WI Championship be played? If at the UWM Panther Arena, wouldn't that be the same cost as a regional? 2nd venue in the Milwaukee area? Or, same as the 1st venue?

Idealy I'd like to do what New England does and run mostly Sat Sun events. This gets rid of students and teachers missing school and mentors having to use vacation time.

Originally Posted by rich2202

Regarding Staffing:

To run 3 events, the Distrcit will need a major step-up in volunteers, especially in key positions. I could see 3 Head Refs, and 3 Lead Robot Inspectors rotating between the 3 District Events (they would be regular refs, and regular robot inspectors when they are not the head/lead).

Other positions (Announcers, FTA, CSA, Scorekeepers, etc.) are just as important, but don't need as many per event as you need Ref's and RI's.

I had several talks with key individuals in several districts in St. Louis this year and they are more than willing to send people to help volunteer and train if necessary.

Also Michigan requires each team at each competition they attend to supply 2 volunteers, this is another fantastic way to build up the volunteer base. I can speak from experience that parents love to volunteer if your team isn't big enough to sacrifice 2 members.

[Richard Wallace]

Originally Posted by EricLeifermann

... Michigan requires each team at each competition they attend to supply 2 volunteers, this is another fantastic way to build up the volunteer base. I can speak from experience that parents love to volunteer if your team isn't big enough to sacrifice 2 members.

Another plug for this, because I know it works. My team's volunteer corps has grown steadily, from one person six years ago, to twenty-three in 2016: One LRI, one CSA, one judge advisor, one game announcer, four referees, five robot inspectors, four field resetters, three pit admins, two event coordinators and one VC. No FTAs or Head Refs, yet -- but I can see that coming also.

We became a district event host team in 2013, and have no plans to stop doing that. Our volunteer presence is a little above average, but not all that unusual in Michigan. I know there are at least a dozen FiM teams with even more volunteer commitment, and more than that who will gladly arrive early and/or stay late to help with set-up and pack-up.

[Michael Corsetto]

Originally Posted by Richard Wallace

Another plug for this, because I know it works. My team's volunteer corps has grown steadily, from one person six years ago, to twenty-three in 2016: One LRI, one CSA, one judge advisor, one game announcer, four referees, five robot inspectors, four field resetters, three pit admins, two event coordinators and one VC. No FTAs or Head Refs, yet -- but I can see that coming also.

We became a district event host team in 2013, and have no plans to stop doing that. Our volunteer presence is a little above average, but not all that unusual in Michigan. I know there are at least a dozen FiM teams with even more volunteer commitment, and more than that who will gladly arrive early and/or stay late to help with set-up and pack-up.

This is some of the magic of districts right here.

I will continue to watch Michigan and dream about what it would be like if CA didn't have 5 RD's with little motivation to make Districts happen...

-Mike

[araniaraniratul]

Originally Posted by Michael Corsetto

This is some of the magic of districts right here.

I will continue to watch Michigan and dream about what it would be like if CA didn't have 5 RD's with little motivation to make Districts happen...

-Mike

It's really funny the rest of us haven't really organized yet. I know for a fact we'd be completely ready to throw a 40 team District-Event here in Berkeley with minimal effort, and I know a few other similar situations.

[Chief Hedgehog]

Originally Posted by Kevin Kolodziej

Current 2 regional team costs:
$5000 first event
$4000 second event
$3500 travel to non local event (bus for 4 days)
$3000 hotel for non local event (3 nights)
Total: $15500

Potential 2 district team costs:
$5000 for two district events
$2000 travel to non local district (bus for 3 days)
$2000 hotel for non local district (2 nights)
Total: $9000
$5000 for DCMP
$3000 travel to DCMP
$2000 travel to DCMP
Additional $10000 with far travel/lodging needed for DCMP

These district numbers as encouraging for the lower-mid tier teams (funding) as the cost is more feasible than two regionals. FRC 4607 is a low to mid-tier team and I would welcome this.

Wisconsin has a few things going for it that MN does not:
1. A large base of mature teams (93, 1714, 1716, 2202 come to mind).
2. Fewer teams to organize (52 vs 208)
3. A rather organized and robust outstate organization in the 7 rivers coalition (yes, some are in MN) that can help lead the charge.

I love our large regionals in the Midwest - but districts seems more viable to the sustainability of FRC. My greatest concern for FRC is if we face another economic dip like we had in 2007; can we continue with large regionals?

[Chief Hedgehog]

It would also serve MN great if WI would go districts first. My greatest concern for all of this is if MN tries to go to Districts before WI - would FIRST hoist WI, ND, and IA on MN?

This is a decision above my paygrade - but I think that with WI going on their own it will then lessen the burden for MN.

Iowa is south enough that they could continue working with MO, NE, and KS so that is not a concern. However, ND only has three teams - they cannot go it alone nor expect to travel to IA (or could they?). If MN has to absorb the three ND teams, what does that do for the MSHSL Tournament? MN cannot lose the partnership with the MSHSL - not without consequences. This partnership is a major selling point with new schools/teams.

I don't like to cheer on WI, but in this case I will! Get it done Badgers!

[Laaba 80]

Originally Posted by Chief Hedgehog

Wisconsin has a few things going for it that MN does not:
1. A large base of mature teams (93, 1714, 1716, 2202 come to mind).

I think this is a huge aspect, though your team list doesn't do it justice. I did a quick look through Eric's rankings, and I counted 18 teams who (I think) have been around 10+ years. That would be 37.5% of WI teams. I'm completely guessing here, but I feel like that is a pretty high % vs other regions in FIRST.

I'm excited to see when/how the district movement comes to WI. I am a bit disappointed I moved to CA before getting to experience districts in WI.

[Chief Hedgehog]

Originally Posted by Laaba 80

I think this is a huge aspect, though your team list doesn't do it justice. I did a quick look through Eric's rankings, and I counted 18 teams who (I think) have been around 10+ years. That would be 37.5% of WI teams. I'm completely guessing here, but I feel like that is a pretty high % vs other regions in FIRST.

I agree. In the moment, that is the few teams that popped in my head as I have seen them in action (I am ashamed that I left out 2826 - a team I have incredible respect for). Wisconsin is prime for Districts. When I look at WI, there are so many great teams that can aid in this. I hope that WI can get this done.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out as the Upper Midwest looks at bringing in two more districts to aid WI, MN, IA, and ND. I hope LaCrosse can gain a regional in 2017. And I know that MN is looking to add another in 2018 - hopefully in St Cloud. If these two locales can get off the ground - we could see districts come to the states of WI and MN shortly.

*By the way - MORE has one of the greatest team apparel concepts. After our rookie season we looked at adopting the Navy Workshirts for 4607 - but after seeing yours and 2052's, we will continue with our plain Black tees and Wind Jackets for the foreseeable future.