F4 - Connect (The new way to get help)

[Akash Rastogi]

Back in my day we would just hop onto AIM and message our friends on other teams questions.

[notmattlythgoe]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

Back in my day we would just hop onto AIM and message our friends on other teams questions.

[bkahl]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

Back in my day we would just hop onto AIM and message our friends on other teams questions.

I think some of the students in the community may now be too young to know what AIM is... how unfortunate.

[Chris is me]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

Back in my day we would just hop onto AIM and message our friends on other teams questions.

Man, I miss AIM. Facebook Messenger just isn't the same, man. It was such a cool way to directly reach out to anyone in the robotics community without having to feel like you were bothering them.

[bkahl]

Originally Posted by Chris is me

Man, I miss AIM. Facebook Messenger just isn't the same, man. It was such a cool way to directly reach out to anyone in the robotics community without having to feel like you were bothering them.

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/se...pe=aim&u=29307

[Akash Rastogi]

Originally Posted by bkahl

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/se...pe=aim&u=29307

Make AIM Great Again - Picone/Kahl 2016

On a more serious note: I usually support new initiatives, and have defended F4 in the past, but I think this is unnecessary and promoting the exclusion of mentors, as well as limiting the knowledge base, is detrimental to the student seeking advice.

Students - if you need advice, reach out to literally any mentor or experienced student on here privately. Shoot us PM's or even download AIM if it still exists.

[bkahl]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

even download AIM if it still exists.

https://i.aol.com/reg/signup?promocode=825974

It does.

[Ben Martin]

I don't see a problem here. The market for this service seems to be for students who want to ask advice of students on other teams who might be intimidated about posting on CD. I can relate to that.

I'm not sure how much activity you'll get, but good luck.

[Conor Ryan]

Originally Posted by bkahl

https://i.aol.com/reg/signup?promocode=825974

It does.

Mobile App

BTW - AIM is still widely used by the commodity trading industry. Most oil deals are negotiated over AIM.

[sammyjalex]

I'm curious why a Q&A forum was the solution that the group pursued instead of any number of other sorts of community-building platforms. I'd love to hear from Sam.

I think that there's a need for more support for students that start outside of their comfort zone and less than comfortable and confident in the FIRST community - more guides like the 358 electronics guides and Code Orange videos, more Karthik presentations, more FRCTop25s. But absolutely - student-focused.

But I'm also concerned, with the CD hivemind, I suppose, that more forums draw participants away from anything that could centralize that community. What I hear from a lot of the folks that are posting is that teaching students to search CD whitepapers, old threads, and photos is an important skill and offers a lot of learning. There seems to be concern that there's fortress getting built around the notion that CD is scary. Maybe it's a concern that this reputation will deter students from ever using CD and it will start to be less used by students. CD only works because so many folks use it year after year. Otherwise, it stops serving as a resource. I think about how NEMO and some Facebook groups have information that's valuable but work more like archives of past work. Why don't we start by working to remove that reputation. I think there's a lot that we can do. Where do we start?
Perhaps, I'm very wrong. I do think that this is a really cool project. I'm excited to see its growth and its success.

I've shared some of these thoughts with other students talking about similar ideas. I would love to see an advice podcast that supports FIRST participants team relationship questions. There are so many relationship advice podcasts - it'd be a fun take on a familiar idea. I would love to see a Facebook page that posts anonymous Q&As - the comments could be cool too. What other solutions did you consider? What other solutions could be fruitful in this community?

I have a question for anyone. What's an experienced student? If I'm a student and I want to ask a student a question, who do I ask? Who identifies the experienced ones. Is it about more posts on CD? Or a team with more banners? Neither seems like a particularly great solution. What do leaders look like in this broad, virtual community.

And there's no correct advice, let's be clear on that. Every major newspaper has an advice column. I think of Social Qs in the New York Times. All of these have a group of folks answering different questions. And they all think about situations very differently. We can certainly have opinions regarding helpful and terrible advice.

[Libby K]

Originally Posted by IronicDeadBird

Interesting my concern with it would be what happens when someone asks a question that is... outside of the scope of the group I guess.
I always felt mandatory reporter laws have a certain weight to them that I wouldn't want imposed on a student.

This was my first concern as I'm reading this thread.
(The other point, on which others have said enough, is that you're basically rehashing Delphi but without the history/community/size.)

Sam (and rest of the F4 crew), there is a reason some things are relegated to the responsibility of adults. Support, friendship, and advice is nice, but there are certain realms of team-dynamic discussions that truly need to be handled differently. If you're really going to go through with this, I'd advise adding an adult or two to your 'board' that you can trust to handle things that are outside the realm of your responsibility.

There are issues that might come up that need to be filtered through a lens of maturity & understanding that I can promise you, you don't have yet while you're still in the 'bubble' of being a student... I don't even think I've gotten it completely down sometimes. Even as the excellent students I'm sure your teams have led you to be, there is still a distinct difference. I hate to use the old-timey phrase 'you'll understand when you're older', but it's true - I hope some other mentors can chime in & express it more eloquently than I have.

Every FIRST community I can think of is moderated or filtered by at least a few adults, and there are good reasons for that. I hope you will at least consider it.

[Pauline Tasci]

Originally Posted by Ben Martin

The market for this service seems to be for students who want to ask advice of students on other teams who might be intimidated about posting on CD.

Chief Delphi might be intimidating at first but I think it's one of those things we all conquer and need to learn how to effectively post on.

When I was a student I was "intimidated" to post on Chief Delphi on fear I would say something stupid. Guess what? I did. We all did.
But having a huge community of people with HUNDREDS of years of combined experience is worth being intimidated. Having an outlet where your question doesn't only benefit yourself but benefits everyone who reads it is worth it.

I also really don't understand why F4 Connect is excluding mentors that have a lot to offer with questions people might ask.
A lot of active mentors on here are alumni of the program and can offer great and accurate advice.

[ATannahill]

I agree with most people that I am concerned about the factual accuracy of the responses. Case in point, the F4 show about districts vs. regionals was littered with inaccuracies and half truths from both sides of the discussion.

But I think Sam (and the F4 crew) has a point in the personal connection being helpful statement. I do not know how many threads I have seen asking about robot connectivity issues where I (and other people) ask questions like "What are you trying to do?", "What are the indicator lights showing?", "Can you walk us through the process and issue you have?" and the original poster never responds. This might be because they have trouble finding their thread again in all the minutiae of CD. In these cases, no one is helped. If F4 Connect can get a direct way to contact someone about their issue (email/aim/(jail) cell number) and actually walk them through the issue to completion, then they are providing a service that is superior to CD. It doesn't matter if someone with a nobel prize answer the question, if the person needing the information does not hear (or understand) it.

It might be good if these types of interactions happen in a glass box so that others can watch and bang on the glass if something isn't quite right. This might be able to be accomplished by posting solutions on a blog with the asker's information redacted.

[Sperkowsky]

The idea of F4 Connect is not to exclude mentors. The only reason for this aspect is because it comes from our all student community. We realize mentors have plenty of knowledge to spread.

If our resource can help a team I do not see why anyone should be against it.

[notmattlythgoe]

Originally Posted by Sperkowsky

The idea of F4 Connect is not to exclude mentors. The only reason for this aspect is because it comes from our all student community. We realize mentors have plenty of knowledge to spread.

If our resource can help a team I do not see why anyone should be against it.

Just because it can help doesn't mean it can't also hurt. That's the problem.