Value & Credibility of 4th robots on an Alliance

[Ernst]

Originally Posted by ASD20

There is a big difference between saying that 4th bots should not exist and belittling the achievements of the 4th bots that do exist. It is the exact same as the difference between saying that 2 Champs shouldn't exist and saying that the winning alliances don't deserve to be called winners (which will be a thread within 30 minutes of the end of Einstein next year). By saying that the 4th bot shouldn't be considered a winner, you are not telling FIRST that you think that they should get rid of 4 bot alliances, you are insulting a team who already probably is doubting their self-worth. If you don't think 4th bots should exist email FIRST, but right now they do, so according to the manual they are considered a full member of the winning alliance and should be treated as such. Plenty of teams hate the bumper rules, but just because you think the bumper rules should change, does not mean you can just show up for a competition with no bumpers. This is no different.

I think 4th bots are a great idea because they make a ton of logistical sense and can allow for some really interesting strategies if alliances plan and use them well. For example, if we hadn't broken, being able to field us as a defensive threat or a decently capable backup bot could have been a huge strategic benefit for the alliance. But we didn't work. So we didn't contribute on the field. So I don't doubt our worth during those matches; I know it was next to nothing.

The only people who really know how much a 4th bot contributed are the members of that team and their alliance. Everyone else can really only form their judgments based on what they see on the field. If a member of a 4th bot team doesn't feel like a full member of the alliance, why would you question that? 3rd and 4th bots can and do get carried. If the alliance wins, they're a member of that alliance, so they also win. But contributions to that blue banner vary, and it diminishes the work of, for example, 1st and 2nd bots to say that their backup bot who didn't play did just as much as they did and is just as deserving as they are. People need to be honest with themselves about this.