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Unread 08-09-2016, 12:14
Caleb Sykes's Avatar
Caleb Sykes Caleb Sykes is offline
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Re: [FIRST EMAIL] Stop Build Day Survey

Quote:
Originally Posted by gblake View Post
I'm pretty sure I never said that the correlation doesn't exist. Quite the opposite.
You said that:

Quote:
Originally Posted by gblake View Post
Scoring points in matches is simply not the correct proxy/metric to use to gauge the success of FRC teams.
Why do you believe it is incorrect? The only reason I would ever say a metric/proxy is incorrect is if it had a small or negative correlation with the variable in which we were actually interested. In fact, I might go so far as to say that we shouldn't even use the words correct and incorrect when describing metrics. We should probably only call metrics "useful" to varying degrees. Do you think team retention is not a good metric/proxy for team success? That could be a valid argument. However, you seem to be saying OPR is a poor metric just because some might use OPR to advocate for policies you disagree with under the incorrect assumption that correlation=causation.



Let me give an alternative example:
Atmospheric CO2 levels has been pretty strongly correlated with average global temperature over the past couple hundred thousand years [1]. Thus, most would say that atmospheric CO2 measurements have been a useful (correct) proxy for global temperature. Many others though, will say that CO2 measurements are an "incorrect proxy/metric" solely because they don't want to deal with the possible implications of the correlation existing. On my linked website, it says:

Quote:
While it might seem simple to determine cause and effect between carbon dioxide and climate from which change occurs first, or from some other means, the determination of cause and effect remains exceedingly difficult.
The relationship is not simple, both of these variables play off of each other, as well as interacting with thousands of others. The correlation is still strong though, which makes atmospheric CO2 levels a useful metric for global temperature.


If you disagree that OPR and team success will remain coupled if we eliminate bag day, that is a perfectly respectable position. I don't believe though that it is a respectable position to discredit useful metrics out of fear of that others might misuse the information contained within them.



[1] http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/globa...re-change.html

Last edited by Caleb Sykes : 08-09-2016 at 12:20.
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