Whats your honest opinion?

[Sean]

Deleted by Sean

[Aaron Knight]

Originally posted by Sean
I guess i just have a differing opinion over what Gracious Professionalism is. I still believe that GP is Utopian but, that does not mean that I don't plan on practicing skills that are conducive of "Gracious Professionalism" I just don't believe that GP is real world and the examples you have given do not "prove" Gracious Professionalism. With all your examples its either something set up for supporting education or a group that there best interest is to work cooperatively. [/b]

If some of the largest collaborative agencies and organizations in science and engineering aren't good examples of groups that have Gracious Professionalism, then what exactly will it take to prove to you that it exists?

(Also, by the way....in one of your previous posts I believe that you indirectly make Science and Engineering fields out not to be in reality....which they definitely are......)

Again, my words, not my team's...

Aaron Knight
Webmaster and Videographer
Team 891: Neverending Chaos....

[SteveB]

BattleBot = RC Car
FIRST = Robotic Device

There is a difference between building a big metal car with hammers and wedges vs. a complex machine that plays a game. the software designs this year were outstanding. Using light sensors, data inputs and outputs, complex system processes constrained by control limitations...now that is a robot!

If you want to smash metal and see who can build a stronger RC car, have at it.

If you want to try and draw more people into the world of robotics, science, technology and yes REAL world applications mentor a team or two.

GP is a real wold everyday thing. If you want to see it in action come to Silicon Valley and spend a day with me. I'll point out to you how companies get started and GP is rule #1.

Steve Bronstein
Advisor
MVRT 115

[Johca_Gaorl]

I have to say that lots of robots this year were nothing more than large RC cars. Even if they did have something to operate, rarely was it used, most of the game was pushing matches and moving boxes, with conveniently shaped RC cars.

[Sean]

Deleted by Sean

[Redhead Jokes]

Originally posted by Sean
I have wasted enough time childishly bickering over the definition of gracious professionalism. If someone here tries to help the program you shouldn't cut them down because they define a word differently. The original plan and idea for this thread has been perverted. The new path this thread is on is petty and childish.

*thinking of that psychological term projection*

GP is not even a factor when it comes to designing the FIRST program.

I disagree. D'oh! Is that a perversion?

[Marc P.]

Originally posted by Sean


All i have to say is that my definition of gracious professionalism is different and i don't think it has such a broad definition. Also if it does have a broad definition than Woodie and Dean named their "catch phrase" incorrectly.
Also companies have a vested interest in supporting programs such as FIRST. If they don't support these programs then the students, their future workforce, wont have the skills necessary and the innovation necessary to help develop and formulate strong designs and ideas that would make a profit for the company.
Also I'm using GP as it pertains to the Science and Engineering Fields not reality or other forms of retail. In Science and engineering the best/fastest/cheapest design/product wins. You are not going to help your competition with their product its not in your interest. So thats why I think GP is Utopian If GP is not in your best interest in the real world companies wont use it and sometimes will do the complete opposite of GP and still succeed. Best interest and Sportsmanship (or maybe Rules of war is a better word) are the real world applications, GP does not exist.

That is exactly the purpose behind Dean and Woodie's philosophies. If students can understand and make use of gracious professionalism on a regular basis, they will become the real world in the very near future, and will not hesitate to apply what they've learned while participating in FIRST. As I've said over and over, it's acknowledged the world has it's problems pertaining to company/market interaction, and at this point it can be quite cuthroat. The idea behind FIRST is to inspire science and technology to the point where people can respect each other, at least on those grounds. Rather than "your robot is better than mine," we see "that's a cool design! can you show me how it works?" There's much more "let me show you how we did this" than "We're better than you." If students maintain this level of integrity when they move into the real world, the real world will change for the better. However, it will not happen overnight. It will take years, even decades for the message to work it's way up the corporate ladder. Once it does, I believe we can expect a much less volitile market, and our civilization will advance even further with companies working together and sharing ideas/technology to better the world as a whole, rather than meet a certain product sales quota, or boost quarterly earnings. Imagine where our technology would be if companies did work together. This is what Gracious Professionalism means to me. That is where I hope the world is heading thanks to FIRST.

[Redhead Jokes]

Originally posted by Marc P.
, rather than meet a certain product sales quota, or boost quarterly earnings. Imagine where our technology would be if companies did work together. This is what Gracious Professionalism means to me. That is where I hope the world is heading thanks to FIRST.

You reminded me of the unspoken "quota" required when I was undercover security arresting shoplifters at a major dept store.

Our director wanted to catch the attention of the west coast director, and asked us to start collecting customer service letters from those we arrested (cuz the rest of the store was "run" on customer service).

I was the only one with the chutzpah to do it.

I treated all with GP, unless it required something "more", and once they settled down, I would again treat them with GP.

[Sean]

Deleted By Sean

[Redhead Jokes]

Originally posted by Sean
Can an admin just delete this thread its an embarrassment to FIRST

*puzzled* I don't think FIRST is embarrassed. I don't think the other posters are embarrassed.

[Aaron Knight]

The only embarrassment I see here is to Sean, perhaps, for his opinion being hounded. FIRST need not be embarrased by any of this.

We can't force Sean to change his mind, and after all, this thread is What is Your Honest Opinion.......

We can only show him the light. I'm not embarrassed by what's been written here.

Aaron Knight
Webmaster and Videographer
Team 891: Neverending Chaos....
Your Lucky Number: 3.141592653589793238964...

[Sean]

Deleted By Sean

[Aaron Knight]

Originally posted by Sean
*This does not reflect team 151 at all this is just venting due to people being close minded and using GP as a cop out answer and excuse. My actions here aer just me at home on my comp. None of this is my teams*


Please refrain from posting Cheryl I have lost all respect for you and any team you "mentor" Imsorry but the posts have been very closeminded and the basic response to every thought out post ive had is "GP is good. Thats not following GP" USE THOUGHTS THAT MEAN SOMETHING NOT this company practices GP when I dont think GP is a real phrase that describes and real actions.Stop saying stuff without backing it up with real clear concise thought out examples. I am not ashamed of what I've said or the way you people have taken it. Yet i dont think it is in the best interest of first to support random rantings between people.
Thanks for being an awesome representative of your team Cheryl.

Umm, Sean....
Every example here has been a clear thought out example of how GP IS and/or SHOULD BE. These are thoughts that mean something... and these are not by any stretch of the imagination random rantings between people. Cheryl just like you has the right to post things, and not necessarily does she by writing have to be an "awesome representative of her team".

By the way, you asked for our opinions by the name of the thread. I'm sorry you didn't get what you wanted.

Aaron Knight
Webmaster and Videographer
Team 891: Neverending Chaos....
Your Lucky Number: 3.141592653589793238964...

[JVN]

Guys,
Calm down...

Take 2 deep breaths, and repeat after me:

"Everyone plays the game differently, everyone has different thoughts on how the game plays. Everyone involved in this competition benefits in one way or another. FIRST and Battle bots are different. Differences are okay. Everyone likes different things. No one is right or wrong. No one needs to have his views changed."

I never thought I'd see militant gracious profesionalism...

How about everyone sleeps on this...

Remember folks... It's just a game!

[Redhead Jokes]

Originally posted by Sean
[BPlease refrain from posting Cheryl [/b]

No.

I have lost all respect for you and any team you "mentor"

Ok.

Imsorry but the posts have been very closeminded

see post 36

Thanks for being an awesome representative of your team

I thank you and my team thanks you (or could that sound I hear be my team thanking me?)