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Unread 07-01-2017, 13:00
Steven Carmain Steven Carmain is offline
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Fuel Seems Undercosted

Does anyone else feel that Fuel is under costed in this game?

You can put in 120 high efficiency or 360 low efficiency Fuel to get the same amount of points as one gear in teleop. (I will concede that there is one QP for Fuel that would be valuable)

Plus, would the field be able to count 360 balls in 150 seconds (full match)?
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Unread 07-01-2017, 13:05
ATannahill ATannahill is offline
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

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Originally Posted by Steven Carmain View Post
Does anyone else feel that Fuel is under costed in this game?

You can put in 120 high efficiency or 360 low efficiency Fuel to get the same amount of points as one gear in teleop. (I will concede that there is one QP for Fuel that would be valuable)

Plus, would the field be able to count 360 balls in 150 seconds (full match)?
It is estimated that the field counters can handle 5 balls (fuel) per second (page 34). That would mean that 360 ball would take about 72 seconds to count.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 13:14
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

Don't ignore the 'pressure' associated with a ball, at 40 kPa you see a Ranking Point, win or lose.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 13:32
beijing_strbow beijing_strbow is offline
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

Notice that the rotor has to be turning to get 40 points. So while that rate is true for the first gear, towards the end 120 fuel is equivalent in points to the 4 gears required for the last rotor.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 13:35
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

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Originally Posted by beijing_strbow View Post
Notice that the rotor has to be turning to get 40 points. So while that rate is true for the first gear, towards the end 120 fuel is equivalent in points to the 4 gears required for the last rotor.
The pilot is required to place 6 gears for the last rotor. They then have to do three rotations of the first gear, which might be harder than some people think.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 13:41
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

Just because a task closely resembles the "main" task of old games, doesn't mean it's the "main" task of this one.

Also, fuel has an effectively infinite scoring potential, whereas gears are finite. True, the gears limit is relatively high and will take many alliances the full match or more to reach, but others will be able to finish them off with plenty of time to spare. In these matches, where both alliances do this, fuel will be the difference maker.

Additionally, there's two very key differences between fuel and most recent shooting tasks: the ball is tiny compared to the robot, and storage is unlimited. Unlike recent games, and especially unlike last year, where you had to make every shot count, pure rate of fire is arguably more important than actual accuracy, and the size difference opens up some interesting possible ways to make this happen.
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Last edited by Joe G. : 07-01-2017 at 14:17.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:00
Neovtan Neovtan is offline
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Smile Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

Can anyone find a rule on how much fuel one robot can carry? Please link a rule where you found the answer
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:02
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

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Originally Posted by Neovtan View Post
Can anyone find a rule on how much fuel one robot can carry? Please link a rule where you found the answer
There is no limit
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:05
Neovtan Neovtan is offline
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

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Originally Posted by Nebster View Post
There is no limit
Where did you find that? I'm telling my team this but I cant find it in the rules
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:08
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

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Originally Posted by Neovtan View Post
Where did you find that? I'm telling my team this but I cant find it in the rules
The fact that you cannot find a limit in the rules is the indicator that the limit is not there.


Also, I believe this was mentioned specifically in the Kickoff stream, I want to say in Blair's segment.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:11
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

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Originally Posted by Neovtan View Post
Where did you find that? I'm telling my team this but I cant find it in the rules
It was said during the live webcast, you can watch a VOD of that, it isn't in the rules because it would only need to mention it if there was a limit. There's is a theoretical limit due to the volume constraints on the robot but other than that there is none.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:25
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

Since the boiler takes about 2 seconds to process fuel, the following questions are:

What is the boiler's capacity?

Are there separate counters for top and bottom?
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:29
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trey178 View Post
Since the boiler takes about 2 seconds to process fuel, the following questions are:

What is the boiler's capacity?

Are there separate counters for top and bottom?
The fuel is recycled onto the field so capacity is essentially infinite.

I'd assume so since they are scored differently.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:31
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

I was wondering, can someone point to me the rule that states only one gear at a time in teleop? Also anyone up for discussing strategy? I'm stuck in a longggg car ride and wanna bounce some ideas.
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Unread 07-01-2017, 14:36
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Re: Fuel Seems Undercosted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack3637 View Post
I was wondering, can someone point to me the rule that states only one gear at a time in teleop? Also anyone up for discussing strategy? I'm stuck in a longggg car ride and wanna bounce some ideas.
A search for "gear" in the rules found this in about 10 seconds:

G27. One-GEAR limit. ROBOTS may not control more than one GEAR at a time.
Violation: FOUL. If strategic, TECH FOUL and YELLOW CARD.
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