Go to Post You lame pig farmer! I'm not talking about a bunch of dudes sitting around eating their packed lunches that Mommy made. - Paul Copioli [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Competition > Rules/Strategy
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 07-01-2017, 18:10
EricH's Avatar
EricH EricH is offline
New year, new team
FRC #1197 (Torbots)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: SoCal
Posts: 19,817
EricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond repute
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by juju_beans View Post
Not sure if this is the right place but would these bumpers be legal?

http://imgur.com/aK9ofzy

The gap is 13 inches but there will be a beam above the bumpers connecting the two sides so that the frame is technically all closed.

edit the two shorter sides are both 6 inches.
Before I answer...
What is your Frame Perimeter? Read R01, particularly the blue box. Now read R22, including the blue box, and R29G. I'll explain in the spoiler, but I'd like you to read those rules first.



Spoiler for The Answer:
Your frame perimeter is a convex polygon formed by the outside corners of your robot, per R01. R22 says that you have to have 6" of bumper on each side of each corner of the frame perimeter, and R29G says that bumpers have to be mounted to the frame perimeter. The portion of the pictured bumpers inside the points are not protecting 6" of frame perimeter, and they aren't mounted to it. The robot portrayed has a rectangular frame perimeter, and the bumpers aren't going to be legal like that.
__________________
Past teams:
2003-2007: FRC0330 BeachBots
2008: FRC1135 Shmoebotics
2012: FRC4046 Schroedinger's Dragons

"Rockets are tricky..."--Elon Musk

Reply With Quote
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 07-01-2017, 18:51
Steven Carmain Steven Carmain is offline
Bit Twiddler
FRC #2832
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Rookie Year: 2002
Location: Westland, MI
Posts: 92
Steven Carmain will become famous soon enough
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
R23. BUMPERS must be located entirely within the BUMPER ZONE, which is the volume contained between the floor and a virtual horizontal plane 7 in. (~17 cm) above the floor in reference to the ROBOT standing normally on a flat floor.
New this year,the top of the bumpers is 7" this year (think bumpers end up 5.5-6.5" tall with fabric. My memory says last year the bumper zone was 5-12" off the ground.
__________________
2017 - Team 2832 Mentor
2016 - Team 6013 Mentor
2002-05 - Team 45 Software/Electrical

A robot is like a campfire: it takes a while to bulid it, and then everyone surounds it!
A world without standards is chaos. A world with standards is chaos.
Reply With Quote
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 07-01-2017, 23:22
GeeTwo's Avatar
GeeTwo GeeTwo is online now
Technical Director
AKA: Gus Michel II
FRC #3946 (Tiger Robotics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: Slidell, LA
Posts: 3,688
GeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond reputeGeeTwo has a reputation beyond repute
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Carmain View Post
New this year,the top of the bumpers is 7" this year (think bumpers end up 5.5-6.5" tall with fabric. My memory says last year the bumper zone was 5-12" off the ground.
Yes, last year's was the highest bumper zone since our rookie year (2012), and this year is the lowest since then. Fortunately, there are no scoring platforms or defenses or anything but flat carpet to drive over.
__________________

If you can't find time to do it right, how are you going to find time to do it over?
If you don't pass it on, it never happened.
Robots are great, but inspiration is the reason we're here.
Friends don't let friends use master links.
Reply With Quote
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 00:30
Munchskull's Avatar
Munchskull Munchskull is offline
CAD Designer/ Electrical Consaltant
AKA: Anthony Cardinali
FRC #0997 (Spartan Robotics)
Team Role: CAD
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: Corvallis, OR
Posts: 532
Munchskull is a splendid one to beholdMunchskull is a splendid one to beholdMunchskull is a splendid one to beholdMunchskull is a splendid one to beholdMunchskull is a splendid one to beholdMunchskull is a splendid one to beholdMunchskull is a splendid one to beholdMunchskull is a splendid one to behold
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

A frame perimeter of 23" x 25" seems tiny! Any ideas of how to make the most of vertical space?
__________________
“In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not.” ― Anonymous
Anthony Cardinali
4th year of FRC
Class of 2017



Reply With Quote
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 17:04
Donut Donut is offline
The Arizona Mentor
AKA: Andrew
FRC #2662 (RoboKrew)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Goodyear, AZ
Posts: 1,308
Donut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond reputeDonut has a reputation beyond repute
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchskull View Post
A frame perimeter of 23" x 25" seems tiny! Any ideas of how to make the most of vertical space?
We kept to a 24" x 26" perimeter last season while staying short enough for the low bar, so it is doable. We did strictly defenses but our arm for defense manipulation cut through 13" of our 26" frame, and there was room for a ball manipulator we were working to try to add at our regional.

Mounting all the large electronics vertically and grouping by power and control sections is how we freed up most of our space. RoboRio, radio, signal light, and VRM went on one side of the bot, battery, PDP, and main breaker went on the other. All were mounted on vertical boards from the chassis bottom to our top frame rails, so 7"-8" of space.
__________________
FRC Team 498 (Peoria, AZ), Student: 2004 - 2007
FRC Team 498 (Peoria, AZ), Mentor: 2008 - 2011
FRC Team 167 (Iowa City, IA), Mentor: 2012 - 2014
FRC Team 2662 (Tolleson, AZ), Mentor: 2014 - Present
Reply With Quote
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 00:52
BryceKarlins's Avatar
BryceKarlins BryceKarlins is offline
Video Production Junkie
FRC #1261 (RoboLions)
Team Role: Electrical
 
Join Date: May 2014
Rookie Year: 2010
Location: Suwanee, GA
Posts: 34
BryceKarlins is on a distinguished road
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Carmain View Post
New this year,the top of the bumpers is 7" this year (think bumpers end up 5.5-6.5" tall with fabric. My memory says last year the bumper zone was 5-12" off the ground.
That was mostly because robots had to be built tall to get over obstacles. Bumper zone is a rule that changes a lot year to year.
Reply With Quote
  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 01:58
DaveL DaveL is offline
Registered User
FRC #2976
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: WA
Posts: 174
DaveL is a jewel in the roughDaveL is a jewel in the roughDaveL is a jewel in the roughDaveL is a jewel in the rough
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

When I first read the rule with the green background, it made no mention of bumpers.

However upon further searching I found this:

R03
Maximum ROBOT size, including BUMPERS and all extensions, must be constrained to one of two volumes: ...

I'm with Blake on this issue and think it needs to be explained by FIRST as its hard to believe they really want us to build small robots with a frame perimeter of 120 inches.

Dave
Reply With Quote
  #8   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 03:40
Chak Chak is offline
Registered User
AKA: Thomas
FRC #4159 (Cardinalbotics)
Team Role: CAD
 
Join Date: May 2015
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: San Francisco, California, USA
Posts: 261
Chak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant futureChak has a brilliant future
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL View Post
I'm with Blake on this issue and think it needs to be explained by FIRST as its hard to believe they really want us to build small robots with a frame perimeter of 120 inches.
I thought the robots looked a little small in the reveal video...
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #9   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 10:38
traxxasracr1's Avatar
traxxasracr1 traxxasracr1 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Blake Hobbs
FRC #3255 (SuperNURDs)
Team Role: CAD
 
Join Date: May 2014
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: california
Posts: 19
traxxasracr1 will become famous soon enough
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

The wcp DS west coast gearbox is about 12" end of axle to end of motor. Two of those sitting exactly next to each other already puts you outside the the frame permiter and into your bumpers if you go with the tall configuration if you put the gearboxes on the long side. Idk, I think that rule is a little ridiculous. But if that's how it's intended to be, then everyone has the same rule and we can't say it's unfair, so we will work around it.
Reply With Quote
  #10   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 11:00
ToddF's Avatar
ToddF ToddF is offline
mechanical engineer
AKA: Todd Ferrante
FRC #2363 (Triple Helix)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: Newport News, VA
Posts: 601
ToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond reputeToddF has a reputation beyond repute
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Kind of makes sense that they released these for 2017, huh?

http://www.wcproducts.net/wcp-ds-flipped
__________________
Todd F.
mentor, FIRST team 2363, Triple Helix
Photo gallery
video channel
Triple Helix mobile
Reply With Quote
  #11   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 13:32
JB987 JB987 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Joe Barry
FRC #0987 (HIGH ROLLERS)
Team Role: Coach
 
Join Date: May 2006
Rookie Year: 2002
Location: LAS VEGAS
Posts: 1,176
JB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond reputeJB987 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by ToddF View Post
Kind of makes sense that they released these for 2017, huh?

http://www.wcproducts.net/wcp-ds-flipped
Total coincidence I'm sure
__________________
"A genius is just a talented person who does his homework" T. Edison
Reply With Quote
  #12   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 13:52
Joe Ross's Avatar Unsung FIRST Hero
Joe Ross Joe Ross is offline
Registered User
FRC #0330 (Beachbots)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1997
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 8,590
Joe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond repute
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

I think there needs to be a sawzall packed in the inspector's crate.
Reply With Quote
  #13   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 15:36
dradel's Avatar
dradel dradel is offline
Registered User
FRC #4557 (Full Metal Falcons)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: CT
Posts: 411
dradel is a splendid one to beholddradel is a splendid one to beholddradel is a splendid one to beholddradel is a splendid one to beholddradel is a splendid one to beholddradel is a splendid one to beholddradel is a splendid one to behold
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

lets not forget about the FIRST iron ons we have to put on the bumpers.....
Reply With Quote
  #14   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 17:19
NShep98's Avatar
NShep98 NShep98 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Nathan Shepherd
FRC #2079 (4H ALARM Robotics)
Team Role: Mechanical
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Rookie Year: 2015
Location: Franklin, MA
Posts: 247
NShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud ofNShep98 has much to be proud of
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by dradel View Post
lets not forget about the FIRST iron ons we have to put on the bumpers.....
Quote:
BUMPER Markings visible when installed on the ROBOT, other than the following, are
prohibited:
...
C. solid white FIRST logos between 4¾ in. (~13 cm) and 5¼ in. wide (~13 cm) (i.e.
comparable to those distributed in the 2017 Kickoff Kit).
Nowhere does it say we have to use those logos. They are simply one of the limited markings allowed to be on them.
__________________


FRC 2079 - 4H ALARM Robotics 2015 - 2017

FLL 2011, 2013
Reply With Quote
  #15   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 08-01-2017, 12:00
Jon Stratis's Avatar
Jon Stratis Jon Stratis is offline
Mentor, LRI, MN RPC
FRC #2177 (The Robettes)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 3,827
Jon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond repute
Re: New size/bumper rules that every team should know

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL View Post
I'm with Blake on this issue and think it needs to be explained by FIRST as its hard to believe they really want us to build small robots with a frame perimeter of 120 inches.
To me, it sounds like reasonable restrictions to make it a good engineering challenge. The game pieces are small this year. Like, really small... I can't remember having one this small before. And there are a lot of them. 600, to be precise. Allowing larger robots means more storage space for game pieces. Smaller robots means the game can playout with game pieces available for everyone, instead of the two robots that hoard everything and shoot them in. Plus, it forces robots to make more trips to shoot, which helps with the requirements for the boiler processing fuel - you would hate to have 300 fuel dumped in 5 seconds before the end of the game and most of it not get counted.
__________________
2007 - Present: Mentor, 2177 The Robettes
LRI: North Star 2012-2016; Lake Superior 2013-2014; MN State Tournament 2013-2014, 2016; Galileo 2016; Iowa 2017
2015: North Star Regional Volunteer of the Year
2016: Lake Superior WFFA
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 13:25.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi