Climbing or No?

[Brian Maher]

Undefendable points in a game that will almost certainly feature brutal defense? Sign me up!

[Kevin Leonard]

I'm honestly astonished how many people think climbing is just a given.
I'd love every robot on my alliance to have a climb, and I agree that it's definitely easier to climb than shoot this year- but there will be robots in eliminations without climbs, even at the championship. If you think climbing is so easy, build 20 climbers and bring 20 ropes and strap them to every alliance partner you can find.
Climbing is worth quite a bit, and it's a relatively easy task, but I wouldn't blame any team for valuing it below other tasks that more directly contribute to ranking points.

[Chris is me]

If you are a team that can accomplish exactly one game task other than driving, I honestly think there is a strong argument for making that task climbing. (I mean, ideally a passive human loaded gear mechanism too, but if you had to pick just one...)

If you're the kind of team that can't afford to both climb and score gears, maybe the Top 8 isn't for you anyway? To get a ranking point consistently, you either need a strong high goal shooter (with auton) or an alliance full of competent gear scorers every match. If strong quick shooting is out of your reach, like it is for many teams, it's okay to not focus on seeding #1 as your main way to win an event.

[throwaway]

Originally Posted by Chris is me

If you are a team that can accomplish exactly one game task other than driving, I honestly think there is a strong argument for making that task climbing. (I mean, ideally a passive human loaded gear mechanism too, but if you had to pick just one...)

Considering that a barebones gear scorer can be very simple I think focusing on climbing is definitely the way to go.

A team can have passive gear intake and rely on the pilots pull of the lift to outtake the gear in this case your gear mechanism can literally just be a slot.

[Devlin Moody]

Excluding some of the new regionals I don't see the top ~6 seeds at a given event not being able to climb, and I definitely don't see their first picks not being able to climb. Once you get into the second round picks, [i]especially[i] at a few of the district events, I would be surprised if more than a couple can climb.

[mathking]

If you don't think that a majority of teams will be climbing consistently that makes it an even better goal to strive for. Think about it from a game theory perspective. If 50%+ of teams are climbing consistently at an event then you probably won't get picked for eliminations without climbing. Making climbing a necessary condition. If 20%- of teams are climbing consistently, and you can climb consistently, you almost certainly will be picked for eliminations. Making climbing a sufficient condition. (Even if you don't have a simple static gear scoring when you arrive, there will likely be teams willing to hack one together.) Even the absolute best fuel gathering and scoring teams will struggle to exceed 50 points in fuel in a match on their own. I don't believe there will many teams capable of getting 40 (going to 60 with the bonus) fuel points on their own but are unable to climb.

[Kevin Leonard]

Originally Posted by mathking

If you don't think that a majority of teams will be climbing consistently that makes it an even better goal to strive for. Think about it from a game theory perspective. If 50%+ of teams are climbing consistently at an event then you probably won't get picked for eliminations without climbing. Making climbing a necessary condition. If 20%- of teams are climbing consistently, and you can climb consistently, you almost certainly will be picked for eliminations. Making climbing a sufficient condition. (Even if you don't have a simple static gear scoring when you arrive, there will likely be teams willing to hack one together.) Even the absolute best fuel gathering and scoring teams will struggle to exceed 50 points in fuel in a match on their own. I don't believe there will many teams capable of getting 40 (going to 60 with the bonus) fuel points on their own but are unable to climb.

I'll just say that climbing is lower on our priority list than being able to get 40 kPa on our own. That doesn't mean we won't have both, or that we'll have either functioning, but that 1 RP/match I feel is essential to maximizing ranking points.