Team Update 2

[Bkeeneykid]

Find the newest one here: https://firstfrc.blob.core.windows.n...amUpdate02.pdf

[bobbysq]

TL;DR Velcro isn't banned yet, but "superfusion" is, whatever that means.

(Q&A is also down, so no definitive answer :/)

[engunneer]

key points

• 40kPA = RP (not 41)
• Rope length measured from DAVIT (DAVIT tails don't count)
• No tape on end of rope
• Rope rules diageam with dimensions

[Bob Steele]

I would guess that superfusion might be something like melting the end of a nylon rope into a feature that is used in climbing. For instance... melting the end of the rope into a solid hook shape or something....

Just my guess...

[nardavin]

Originally Posted by bobbysq

TL;DR Velcro isn't banned yet, but "superfusion" is, whatever that means.

(Q&A is also down, so no definitive answer :/)

I read this as yes, velcro is banned. From the example box: "FIRST Robotics Community members are innovative and may discover a way to fuse the end of the ROPE in a way that can be leveraged for competitive advantage. This 'superfusion' extends the fusing’s purpose beyond only preventing fraying."

You could, in theory, still use a rope that acts like the loop-side of velcro that you could grip with hook-side on your robot.

[PayneTrain]

Nothing stopping the velcro brigade from fashioning a rope that coincidentally manages to mesh with the hook side of hook-and-loop fastening...

(at least until someone does it and hurts the GDC's feelings because someone found a way that made their challenge easier than they wanted it to be)

[Kevin Sevcik]

Velcro only on the end of the rope seems to be banned. I think Velcro sewn along the length of the rope is also banned, or will be one you guys push on it. Velcro as rope probably has a short lifespan as well. I'd suggest you temporarily forget Velcro exists and see if you can come up with a different climbing design, just to save time. It's not like a Velcro climber is hard, people.

[Chris is me]

They are really going to need to address this Velcro thing one way or another at some point. I'm a bit worried that the Velcro questions in the Q&A are going to be dismissed as "can't rule on legality of specific designs" or something like that, and we'll carry this ambiguity past the first week of build season.

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

Velcro only on the end of the rope seems to be banned. I think Velcro sewn along the length of the rope is also banned, or will be one you guys push on it. Velcro as rope probably has a short lifespan as well. I'd suggest you temporarily forget Velcro exists and see if you can come up with a different climbing design, just to save time. It's not like a Velcro climber is hard, people.

This is what any smart team is doing, I think, but the second that Velcro is confirmed legal is the second we can redirect those efforts elsewhere.

[GreyingJay]

Yeah, I read that as saying "you can't use a strip of Velcro and claim it is the mechanism by which you are preventing the end of your rope from fraying", as it then has more purpose than simply fusing the end of the rope.

[engunneer]

I actually don't see any prevention of velcro in the current rules, Team updates, and Q&A AS LONG AS you pay attention to how the material is constructed, and how you attach it to your rope.

[efoote868]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

Velcro only on the end of the rope seems to be banned. I think Velcro sewn along the length of the rope is also banned, or will be one you guys push on it. Velcro as rope probably has a short lifespan as well. I'd suggest you temporarily forget Velcro exists and see if you can come up with a different climbing design, just to save time. It's not like a Velcro climber is hard, people.

From the Q&A and this update, it looks like if you weave the loops portion into the rope it'll be legal. And if the loops portion of specifically Velcro is banned, it should not be very difficult to find another natural fiber with similar properties. I don't think the GDC will come out and say "Velcro as a rope is legal," because you'll have some team that tries to use the hooks portion only of Velcro with adhesives when that doesn't meet the definition of rope.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Assuming the GDC wants to ban Velcro, their easiest option is to just ban the use of hook and loop fastener to attach to the field.

[tig567899]

From what I interpret, you're still allowed to stitch non-tape velcro to the end of your rope, just not fuse your rope with velcro.

[FrankJ]

If the Q&A is fixed long enough I think the Velcro question will be answered. But with I am thinking the way the update 2 is written, it will not be legal.

On the other hand you should be weave fibers in the rope to simulate the hoop part of the velcro. That would be enough to thread the rope on the lift drum. Think 'Superfrayed" the polar opposite of superfusion.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by Logan Byers

This is highly relevant. I forgot the strand part of the definition. I don't think braiding strips of Velcro will work, since a strip of Velcro is hardly a strand. I think the Velcro brigade is down to hoping that a strip of Velcro counts as a rope.