[Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks

[Marc P.]

I wasn't around in '99, but I've seen and heard many stories about the Puck. I'm intruiged by the idea of a mobile object robots can climb on and score. It would only be worth 10 points with a robot on top on the edge of the field, but worth 50 if in the center of the field. Would make for some good pushing matches, and all the more challenging if the thing can move.

I'd also like to see some odd game object, like orange safety cones. Cones are worth 5 points only if standing up, and worth 15 points when stacked on top of each other. I know I'll get lynched for this, but I liked the time multipliers of 2001. Adds a very interesting element to strategy

[Nate Edwards]

I would like to see something with multiple shaped balls and objects (like the bowling pins, footballs, tennis balls, and roadcones.) Each one has different point values and certain ones have to be done by the robot and certain ones by the human player... It would all be on a revolving field. The drivers stations stay in the same spot but the field revolves. Maybe it makes 4 rotations and the balls possibly would be color coded or something and there are different goals etc... It would make the game intresting I think.. how about a huge road cone that you have to cap the goals with and you have to capture it from your opponent. I read some of the posts and really liked them so incorparated them into mine. Any of these ideas sound really cool.

Nate

[Joe Reel]

I agree with the ideas:
1. multiple level playing field
2. 2 vs 2 robots
3. scoring zones
4. multiple shaped objects varying in size (ie. soft balls and 30" balls )

I would add an element of the game that would be a lever type assembly that has a bucket attached to it so that when enough small objects were in it it would lift a barrier that covers a larger goal for the larger size objects. The bucket could be removable thus introducing a defensive side to the game. It would also add another task of picking the bucket up and placing it back on the lever arm.

[MattK]

I would love to see various terrains (maybe a pit of packing pop-peanuts or something like that)... that would emulate real terrain much better.

[Team311]

corn cernals

[Tom Bottiglieri]

Every year there has been some kind of fixed area that teams could score points at the emd of the match by being on, above, near, etc. I like this idea. What I do not like about this is that the place that gives the points is the same all the time. Last year with the ramp, this year with the bar. Teams could then just go sit on the bar for the whole match and get an auotmatic 50 points. What If there were a few "Bonus" areas on the field, and the Computer would randomly select a spot that robots had to be in at the end of the match for the bonus points. But, the spot would be selected and shown on the big screen DURING The macth. I think that would be a good way to show how things that you design (mars rover, anyone?) may have to overcome different tasks, but may have to do them on the fly without that much time to prepare for it.

Thats my 2 cents

[robolemur1236]

Differering layers of carpet would work, like the robot has to "wade" through a section to get to the scoring zone? maybe?

[Adam Y.]

I'd like to see a walking challenge!

Too late some one all ready built a walking robot. I think it was for zone zeal.

[MPblankie]

I was really disappointed in this years game. I think the balls are getting old, but I have been waiting for tennis balls for a long time. The don't pop either, unless ran over by a lawnmower, which I have done. I also like the idea of getting rid of the carpet. There are always complaints of it getting torn up. I also like human player involvement but not as much as this year, and not as little as last year. The balancing ramp was a really good idea a few years ago. It took skill and it was very exciting to watch as a spectator.


I think future games also have to keep in mind, poorer and newer teams. The games are getting harder and harder for rookies, and if I were new, I would not want to join. Teams without much money also don't have the money or space to build a whole field or enough to buy 72 pipe flanges for goals.

[811SmallFry]

This IS my first year on a team, so I really can't relate to other years- but I agree, balls probably do get old fast.
I think that another texture flooring would be good- something that doesn't have a lot of tread, to add to the confusion.
I liked the hanging- but I think that having something movable that the robots have to get on would be cool.
I LOVE the idea of whichever ball is on top gets all the points- it would REALLY put the pressure on!
Some suggestions from my team are to keep the stairs, NO MORE BOXES, and to do more with autonomous.
I would really like to see the idea with only seeing from the "Robot's-eye view"...
I think that's all I have to add.. I was also thinking something with buttons, and when you press them, SOMETHING happens... I'm not quite sure... The idea is still formulating

[Specialagentjim]

Im also still interested in the "invisible to the human eye" identifiers of scoring objects.

For example, have a scoring object that emits a "point" or "no point" IR pulse code. Human eye can't see it, but the robot's gripper could have a receiver to read the pulse, and relay that information back to the driver so he/she can determine whether to score that box or not.

It would mimic real world robotics problems today, forcing robots to feedback information to their operators who are unable to fully understand what's going on in the robot's environment (robots in iraq, robots in space, robots undersea, robots in nuclear facilities - all places where a human cant visibly be there with the robot and has to rely on sensor feedback).

[hansTP2S]

here we go, since i already posted this in the first thread, before seeing this thread, and for some reason you cannot delete posts, but whatever

It is basically a pseudo-capture-the-flag in which there is one item that starts of on the top of a pole and it is worth an extra X points, this object is symmetrical, one half of it is one alliance's color, the other half is the other color (basically if you were to lay a pillow flat, the top half would be red and the bottom half would be blue). To get those points at the end of the match you must fullfill two requirements: your robot must be on the opponent's half of the field (or maybe up on top of some stairs or something as well) and the item must be laying on your robot somewhere: laying is defined as (this definition is made to make as few loopholes as possible): touching only your robot(not other robots or the ground) and only touching your robot where your color is on the object.

It seems like a good idea, the only problem with it that i can see is another robot can just touch it at the last second. However this could also be seen as an advantage, because it adds a LOT of excitement into the end of the game.

[sanddrag]

If anyone knows that really old Nickelodeon TV game show Legends of the Hidden Temple, they had a variety of really great game challenges (for humans) that could perhaps be used in a FIRST game (for robots or human players).

[hansTP2S]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

If anyone knows that really old Nickelodeon TV game show Legends of the Hidden Temple, they had a variety of really great game challenges (for humans) that could perhaps be used in a FIRST game (for robots or human players).

THAT SHOW WAS AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 111111oneoneone

but yeah kind of an obstacle course dealio.

maybe the robot could do something to make it easier for the human player..but that would put more emphasis on the hp in leiu of the bot. i thought the amount of hp interaction was pretty good this year.

[jerry w]

Things I did NOT like in 2004.
Static tasks

Scoring awarded Teams too many points for a static task. A team could hang from the bar much too soon in the game. The 50 points gotten were easy points, since no other tasks had to be done. If the point value of a hanging robot were 40 instead of 50 points, this would encourage more active task participation.

Autonomous

Autonomous mode could not tackle most of the tasks in the game. Of course, 2004 saw us with a new controller. The newness made autonomous mode extra difficultly. Nevertheless, there ought to be a choice of simple tasks during the autonomous phase. The ball triggering was simple enough, but more tasks would be better.

Things that I DID like in 2004
Task quantity

The multitude of tasks during a match meant that teams had to decide which task to do and when to do it.

Navigation

Navigation beacons were a great idea. If teams have time this summer, they can learn how to use the beacons. This would be great during autonomous mode next year.

Choices

Two pathways were available for a robot to use for reaching the other side of the field. This provided flexibility.

Scoring

The simplified scoring, along with the use of the opponents’ points, was much easier to understand than in the past.

Suggestions for another game in 2005
Game objects

Next year should use the boxes instead of balls. A change between round and non-round requires that teams change their thinking about the objects, and not just modify the manipulator from last year.

Object location

Have the human player place an object on the field that an opponent robot must locate and move. The scoring should award Points for moving the object into a goal area.

Human player

Make the human player active at the start of the game as was done in 2003. This provides visual proof to the audience that the humans and robots do interact.

Vertical control

Include a tall task (like a hanging bar, or stacking), so that teams learn how to maintain balance, or learn how to prevent toppling.

Carriers

Provide a wheeled object on the field that can support a robot. Allow a partner robot to move the object while it is supporting an alliance robot.

Dynamic field

Provide a hinged pathway to a platform. The rules should allow the robot to move the pathway (ramp) to an open or closed position. The platform can trap a robot, unless the partner moves the pathway into a proper position.

Goal post

Use a goal-post in the game. A robot gets points by touching each goal post in sequence. Award Extra points for moving an object from the first to the second goal post.

Obstacles

In 2004, teams did climb an obstacle, though it was not required. Perhaps we should have an obstacle to climb which results in points.

Cooperation

Require a partner to pass an object to the alliance robot to get points. Each team should have their robot supported in different marked field areas to count toward points during the pass.

Active tasks

Provide at least two constructive tasks that result in points. For example, stacking boxes, or positioning an object into a field zone would earn points.

Zones

Devise an inner court and outer court on the field. Make the transfer to the inner court a task that requires cooperation with the partner. The partner must activate a lever, or slide a wheeled object to cause the alliance partner to reach the inner court. The points for doing tasks in the inner court should be double the points for those on the outer court.

Autonomous

Provide a large selection of tasks to do in autonomous mode, with points for each task. Teams must then tailor robot design to complete one or more of these tasks.

i have more ideas, but i also have some mercy.
Jerry W