New chat feature?

[mtrawls]

In the continued tradition of making Brandon do as much work as possible, I present the following idea: a "chat" feature. I.e., something akin to AIM or ICQ, etc. For a similar feature on another message board, see perlmonks.com (you must be logged on to contribute, but anyone can read the chat area) -- their chat feature is called the "chatterbox", quite appropriately. It's just an unobtrusive box on the side of the screen that includes the most recent text, which appears on most of the pages.

I was motivated to this suggestion by the posts here and especially here. (I certainly don't mean to pick on Raven_Writer.) The reason is that the second post, especially, seems like a conversation that is more appropriate for a chat program like AIM; but there can certainly be a case made for it being posted to a forum like this, even though it is not specifically targeted to the subject in any way. I was trying to decide whether the incident meritted a negative repuatation, and when I had just about decided to PM him about it as a "warning" (more of an inquisitive manner directed to see why he thought it was appropriate I guess), I thought of this idea.

Using the forums in a way like you would use AIM is inappropriate, it seems (though I couldn't find anything in the rules). But often times there is some justified need for this. The chit-chat forums are a very useful outlet for many cases, but there are some instances where the discussion is ephemeral, and not worthy of (or rather, not needing) recording for all posterity. An example would be the posts above, or maybe some tangential discussion, or something even along the lines of "any advice for new programmers" -- sure there are threads galore on this, but having a chat feature where a quick, almost immediate answer to this to point the user to those threads and other resources, without cluttering up the forums with repeated posts, might very well alleviate the problem.

Before anyone gets all excited about it, though, let me say there there are tons of problems with the idea. It seems to re-invent the wheel -- why include this, if people can just go on AIM (or some other program) and talk to each other already. It seems to be time intensive, error-prone, and would require some re-structuring, perhaps, of the site's layout. It might not be needed; either the above cases being inappropriate for the site, or the rarity of them (and their occurrence in off-season) not making necessary anything special.

But, to counter that, the CD community is a specialized niche. It would be nice to be able to say something that everyone browsing could immediately see, without having to make something as permanent as a post (perhaps the subject is less important, or even just a casual "any late-nighters this midnight?") It could, undoubtedly, be an important tool -- but there is still a question of is it a needed tool. I urge those interested to see perlmonks.com, and look at how their CB is used.

/end friendly, helpful but perhaps completely impractical or unnecessary suggestion
/begin flaming


EDIT
In response to "A.12.3" -- there are more than several ways to handle this, but the primary intent of this discussion isn't the implementation but rather the merits of the idea itself.

[Astronouth7303]

1. Set up an IRC server (irc.chiefdelphi.com). that's the hard part.
2. Load PJIRC, and put a link to it in the 'Quick Links' Menu. that's the easy part.

It's also worth noting that many IRC servers use opensource software, and that PJIRC itself is open source.

Basically, Your IRC user ID is the same as your CD user name.

[David Kelly]

There was a chat feature built into the forums back a while ago, 1 or 2 years ago. It wasn't the greatest and it wasn't used much at all. It was requested to be put up, and it wasn't used much at all so Brandon took it back down. If there was a real high demand for it, I could see it as being useful, but I don't think it's really necessary. There are mods on the forum to prevent the "chatter" in the threads and the PM and Email features are built into the system for the reason of chattering.

[Astronouth7303]

If you want one, but there isn't a demmand for it hosted locally, I'll register another one one Chatspike.net. it also has PJIRC for those who don't have a client

[edit]There is an old thread from when they chaged servers. [[CDThread:34|Chat...]] Chat...[/edit]

[mtrawls]

Hrm ... I realize there are a lot of things that mitigate the potential use of the system, though I still think it could be useful. I didn't realize about the past failed attempt (I searched for a little bit, but apparently either there is no discussion of it, the search isn't all that good, or more likely I can't search). I do question, though, how integrated it was in the site, -- and if it was a feature like the CB on perlmonks which is tightly integrated, unobstrusive but visible on every page, what the demand would be.

[Mike Schroeder]

you guys realized that you could use the Tigerbolt chat, which is on irc.webchat.org port 6667 or you can use this weblink to get a java applet : http://www.rit.edu/~us1stwww/info.html

[Cory]

Unless something amazing happens, Tigerbolt is dead. I remember the good ole' days when there would be up to 40+ people in there, all talking, and now you're lucky if there's 3 and 2 are away.

Cory

[Astronouth7303]

Originally Posted by Cory

Unless something amazing happens, Tigerbolt is dead. I remember the good ole' days when there would be up to 40+ people in there, all talking, and now you're lucky if there's 3 and 2 are away.

Cory

do what we wikians do: put a link to it in your sig!

[Max Lobovsky]

Originally Posted by Astronouth7303

1. Set up an IRC server (irc.chiefdelphi.com). that's the hard part.
2. Load PJIRC, and put a link to it in the 'Quick Links' Menu. that's the easy part.

It's also worth noting that many IRC servers use opensource software, and that PJIRC itself is open source.

Basically, Your IRC user ID is the same as your CD user name.

I second Astronouth's suggestion. I think a chatterbox is too similar to the function of CD itself. It is will destroy the organization that a forum provides, but at the same time, not provide truly live communication. The IRC room is a more realtime, and less logged (sure it can be logged, but it isn't a half-forum like the chatterbox), so it can coexist with CD without infringing on its usefulness.

[Greg Needel]

Originally Posted by Cory

Unless something amazing happens, Tigerbolt is dead. I remember the good ole' days when there would be up to 40+ people in there, all talking, and now you're lucky if there's 3 and 2 are away.

Cory

it is dead now but during the season there is atleast 3-5 people in there all the time, with an increase during the build season i know because i am one of them.

[Cory]

3-5... and two-3 are only there because theyre mods...

[Amanda Morrison]

I'm totally down with irc.

/me likes this idea, but knows Brandon is swamped with work.
Maybe you guys could come up with ideas, how to implement, how to moderate, etc.? That may help him a bit.

[Astronouth7303]

Originally Posted by Amanda Morrison

I'm totally down with irc.

/me likes this idea, but knows Brandon is swamped with work.
Maybe you guys could come up with ideas, how to implement, how to moderate, etc.? That may help him a bit.

Well, we can borrow server code from Freenode.net (http://source.freenode.net/~asuffield/dancer/). PJIRC is also open source, which is found at http://www.pjirc.com/downloads.php?p=0&c=4&downid=121.

My thought is make a page with the applet on it. There is a link to it on the quicklinks menu (which opens it in a new window). The User's UserName is used as the IRC name.

You can also seperate out conversations in channels, so the group talking about the default code isn't hearing about the new 3dsmax stuff. (and vice versa)

One drawback is that when ever I open a java applet in IE, it just closes.

I can make you a basic page if you want (granted, w/o the CD styling)

[Brandon Martus]

I'll have to give the sidebar/chatbox thing some thought.

We've tried IRC & java/non-java based chats .. they never work out. And, theres always Tigerbolt, so why re-invent the wheel.

[Ken Leung]

Just something to consider. In the past when someone try to setup a chat for Chief Delphi Forum members it ended up being too small or too large. They were too small when only view visit the place and it never build up the momentum to get it started. They were too big when everyone went in and all you can see is a constant spam of chatter going all over the log.

Consider how it will be if the CD forum only have 1 section. There would be 50 new threads a day under 1 section. It will become hard for people who prefer focused conversations. Would it be possible to setup multiple chat rooms? Have a main lobby, and people can make announcement to all the little chat room when they want to, but give people the abilities to start their own little room for smaller discussions.

But that sounds like too much work. Just something to think about.