Appropriate use of reputation points

[Max Lobovsky]

Andy, I think most of use are not really complaining, but more expressing disappointment at the behavior of some members of the community. As I stated in my earlier post. If you haven't already, read Mrawls, or my earlier post to get an idea for what sort of actions we are talking about.

[Bharat Nain]

Originally Posted by maxlobovsky

Andy, I think most of use are not really complaining, but more expressing disappointment at the behavior of some members of the community. As I stated in my earlier post. If you haven't already, read Mrawls, or my earlier post to get an idea for what sort of actions we are talking about.

Good Negative reputation point:
Situation: I teased Big Mike on the Segway
Neg. Rep: Katie Reynolds give me a negative reputation point says its not too good


Bad negative reputation point:
Situation: how fast is your robot? me: 10ft/sec theoritically, but seems much faster
Point: stop exagerrating, you 25 scumbag

Now, although Big Mike is my good friend, I really shouldn't make fun of him in public, especially on a forum, so I thanked Katie for it and deleted the psot

The Bad reputation point, I love team 25, its my team, I've done heaps for it, and someone hurt me, WHAT!!! UGHH, I WANNA KILL HIM, !!!!
Nah, thats never my attitude, its simple, you wanna hate, go right ahead, you wanna do WHATEVER go right ahead..

On an overall, the reputation system should not take you in the wrong direction. i.e. you shouldn't have 7 neg. rep points at one time unless you've done something real wrong.

So don't really bother with a few negative reputation points and especailly their comments, Yes, they hurt, real bad sometimes, but forget it, the other person just needed his/her 5 minutes, let them have it and you can have the rest. Seriously fellas, I know how disappointing it is, long ago I had many red dots in my user cp, and i used to get depressed looking at them, but its not worth. Eventually it will all be fine, so just take it easy and give the other person their 5 minutes if you think its not justified.

Originally Posted by maxlobovsky

Andy, I think most of use are not really complaining, but more expressing disappointment at the behavior of some members of the community. As I stated in my earlier post. If you haven't already, read Mrawls, or my earlier post to get an idea for what sort of actions we are talking about.

No matter what you do, you're always going to run into jerks that abuse the system...no matter where you are, unless you live in a monestary or something like that...

Basically, there really is nothing you can do about it except deal with it or bar the reputation system all together. If i'm not mistaken this is the 2nd or 3rd thread that has been dedicated to complaining about the reputation system. Again, reinforcing what Andy said, go on with your lives, do what you want and deal with it.

[JAH]

How I look at it...taking whoever for example(someone with all those green dots that just make their posts more colorful)...are they a better person than I am? Possibly...but possibly not. I just don't post as much maybe. Overall, is rep on CD going to mean anything to anyone in 20 years? Or even at a comp later next year...I sincerely hope not. Just my comments...

[Billfred]

Well, there is a simple solution here...we start giving feedback on how people give feedback. Surely there's room for another bar up there...

[mtrawls]

Originally Posted by D.J. Fluck

Basically, there really is nothing you can do about it except deal with it or bar the reputation system all together. If i'm not mistaken this is the 2nd or 3rd thread that has been dedicated to complaining about the reputation system. Again, reinforcing what Andy said, go on with your lives, do what you want and deal with it.

Oh, ... I really hope that is not how this thread is seen: as "complaining about the reputation system." And I hope too that people don't think "there really is nothing you can do about it." I started this thread not to complain, but to spark a debate so that the system could perhaps be improved, or at least its limitations more understood. Now, what Mr. Baker said is very smart and is a very good point to consider. But please don't see me as complaining; the system can be changed for the better by various actions, ... and the only way that any change might be affected is by intelligent debate. And even without change, an intelligent discussion (as opposed to complaining) is a good thing for the community.

Sure, there are those that take the system to the extreme, and you can't really change them -- they are who they are. But anyone who refuses to talk to someone of lower rep, or assumes someone with 10 bars is smart or insightful is reading into the system far more than can accurately be read. If the system is to stay, in my most humble opinion it should not be meaningless; to make it more meaningful, its weaknesses must be addressed and discussed intelligently (whether or not that results in any official change). Again in my opinion, we shouldn't tell people how to give out rep; but that doesn't mean we can't offer suggestions (as we currently do). I'm not necessarily advocating any change in the system -- but a discussion is certainly needed, even if it is a re-discussion (or, as it seems, a re-re-re-discussion).

I hope I haven't overstayed my welcome in this thread, but I felt I needed to clear up some things.

[Bharat Nain]

"I talked to John AND Andy... and they have more rep than me! Wooooo!"

P.S: John told me to post

[Ken Leung]

Originally Posted by Andy Baker

As for abuse of positive rep or negative rep, I don't understand. If you are free to say what you want, then someone else is free to give you negative or positive rep about it. If they are being a jerk about it, then they have to deal with the ramifications. How is that abuse? We're all supposed to follow an outline of how to give positive and negative rep? I know how I give rep points, but that is just me. I don't worry about how everyone else is giving them. Nor do I tell others how to give our their rep comments. Do what you want. Deal with the results.
Andy B.

The part that people care the most about is their appearance in front of the community. That's where reputation hurt the most, because you are in front thousands of people in this program being judged in a spot light. You aren't sure of how you are being judged, you have an idea what they like or don't like to see, but it doesn't really matter if you are right or not because ultimately yourself is the harshest judge of them all.

The reputation point system is an interesting idea to throw out to the community. Everyone have some sort of idea on how it should and shouldn't work, and people did what they wanted for a year and had fun for a year. It seems to me the discussions in here prompted a bigger questions about the Chief Delphi Forum, and that is, what is the appropriate behavior in this forum. We only give or take reputation points when we see something we like or don’t like. Problem is, there are too many standards out there.

We all have different system of right and wrong. That will never change. I for one do not agree with people answering questions in the form of "I am not sure but..." or posts that ask for nothing but trouble. We all have our pet peeves in this forum. Only, with a weapon (or reward) so easily at hand ready to punish people whenever we feel like it, some people use it more often then they should. And that's something to think about: What message are we sending to the community?

Are we saying we are so lazy at reading people's post that we have to rely on what others thing of them base on how many (or little) green dot that person has, especially when half the dots given or removed are based on acts that are half serious only? For those of us veteran posters, of course not. But any rookie member might come in and see the dots and care more than they should, and I think that's a bad message to send out. I would hate to see us teaching students with anything other than patience, example, and truth.

But Enough about that. People seem to want a reputation system to play with, so I am not going to argue. Anyway…

There are ups and downs with the reputation system, which come from how people use the system. But instead of arguing what's right and wrong, which is only going to dig us deeper into the hole, I think we ought to think of ways to improve the system.

For example, I truly believe that we should add an + zero reputation button so people can give comments to each other without being forced to give or take reputation points. A lot of times when I want to give constructive criticism to a fellow poster, but I don't want to take away rep points, so I awarded them instead. After all, what kind of mentors are we if we can't tolerate some mistakes. If I had the option, I wouldn’t have to do that, and would choose to comment on a lot more posts.

All I ask is for the rest of you to think about it, don't reply so quickly.

[Andy Baker]

Originally Posted by Andy Baker

I too think that the rep point system is over-rated. It has some merits, but it also gets too much attention. People joke about it, complain about it, and debate it. We all are guilty of giving it more credit than it is worth.

As for abuse of positive rep or negative rep, I don't understand. If you are free to say what you want, then someone else is free to give you negative or positive rep about it. If they are being a jerk about it, then they have to deal with the ramifications. How is that abuse? We're all supposed to follow an outline of how to give positive and negative rep? I know how I give rep points, but that is just me. I don't worry about how everyone else is giving them. Nor do I tell others how to give our their rep comments. Do what you want. Deal with the results.


Andy B.

Sheesh... the above quote was my attempt at being as brash and blunt as I could be about this, hoping that someone would give me some negative rep points. I even put in there "please give me some negative rep" to prove that I really don't care too much about this system. But that seemed to obvious to me, so I deleted that sentence.

Honestly, if you wish to bash someone because you don't agree with them or you think that they are being to harsh, you should feel like you have that right. I'm SURE that I ticked a few people off with the above post, but no one gave me any negative rep points.

Do you guys see what I am saying? Not only should we feel free to post what we want to think, we should also feel free to give each other negative or positive rep points. You just need to be able to back up your opinions and stand by what you say.

Andy B.

[edit: woohoo! I've got 3 negative reps for this post... keep 'em coming!]

[Rich Kressly]

Originally Posted by Andy Baker

Sheesh... the above quote was my attempt at being as brash and blunt as I could be about this, hoping that someone would give me some negative rep points. I even put in there "please give me some negative rep" to prove that I really don't care too much about this system. But that seemed to obvious to me, so I deleted that sentence.

Honestly, if you wish to bash someone because you don't agree with them or you think that they are being to harsh, you should feel like you have that right. I'm SURE that I ticked a few people off with the above post, but no one gave me any negative rep points.

Do you guys see what I am saying? Not only should we feel free to post what we want to think, we should also feel free to give each other negative or positive rep points. You just need to be able to back up your opinions and stand by what you say.

Andy B.

Ahh.........It's much simpler to tell everyone that you are funny looking Baker If anyone needs that backed up, just look at the blue hair or that pig wrestling sequence.

In all seriousness, here's a thought for everyone: Don't worry about what you can't control.

[Jessica Boucher]

Any way you slice it, it's still a whole lot better than the old system of self-worth by number of postings.

"The more you know who you are and what you want, the less you let things upset you." - Bill Murray, Lost in Translation

As it's been said before, just keep track of making a solid argument. You can't control how others feel about you, so take the risk and post something substancial. Sometimes people won't like it, but most of the time people will....and eventually the green will overshadow the red.

[Billfred]

Well, lemme throw an idea out.

Suppose there was an option to give rep anonymously, but at less strength. Kinda like warnings on AIM. Do you think that would make people less hesitant to speak their minds fully?

(Of course, I'd imagine that B-money and his homies could still see whodunnit, given that they are teh skills and that someone's bound to abuse it eventually, just like non-anonymous rep.)

[Jeff Waegelin]

Originally Posted by Billfred

Well, lemme throw an idea out.

Suppose there was an option to give rep anonymously, but at less strength. Kinda like warnings on AIM. Do you think that would make people less hesitant to speak their minds fully?

(Of course, I'd imagine that B-money and his homies could still see whodunnit, given that they are teh skills and that someone's bound to abuse it eventually, just like non-anonymous rep.)

I very much dislike the idea of anonymous rep. I feel that one of the best parts of the reputation system, is that it holds users accountable for what comments they give. It's pretty easy to abuse a comment (or reputation, or AIM warning) system if nobody will know it was you who did it. If, on the other hand, you know that the other person will know you did it, you'll be much more likely to think about what you say, and only make comments that are appropriate and necessary. So, I think, in essence, tying reputation to your username keeps the system in check, at least a little bit. Opening reputation up to anonymous comments is just asking for trouble, in my opinion.

[Rez648]

Originally Posted by Corey Balint

Ive got 2 rep bars, and im not a famous/important person in first, but i could be important to someone on my team or to people on other teams, thats what really matters.

I totally agree with this!! I don't have the best rep on CD, but I am a respected member on my team and I respect every single person on my team and I respect all of those that are a part of FIRST, regardless of their rep on CD.

[Matt Adams]

Alrighty, I'm gonna throw some things out here on the topic of reputation, since this thread has digressed a bit anyway. This is going to be blunt. Sorry kids.

I think the reputation system works, but it's labeled wrong. The reputation should simply be called, "Cheif Delphi Contribution Rating." This would get rid of these crazy complains about reputations, popularity and the like. We've hashed this talk over and over.

I think the system in place works and works well. People who contribute the most worthwhile posts have the most reputation by and large. No system is perfect, this one is darn good. People who contribute worthwhile posts consistantly get reputation. To be blunt, people who don't have a high rating do not contribute frequent AND worthwhile posts. Mind you, perhaps one or the other is true, but not both.

Most of the people who complain about not having a high repuation are frequent contributors, but seldom share anything worthwhile. I wasn't around in the "good ole days" of Cheif Delphi, but from what I gather, this site was once a technical eutopia. The technical cutting edge information is still here, but a bit harder to find.

At this point in the history of CD, the number of "reputation points per green box" ratio need to be adjusted. Too many people have too many boxes. I think it might be easier to just divide all of the points by 10 and call it a day, but regardless, there are lot of people that have (or nearly have) maxed out the buttons, but are far from the oh-so-flattering title given to them. Myself included.

And that's about that.

Matt