ISRAEL REGIONAL OFFICAL!!!

[J Flex 188]

Point well raised Karthik and David Kelly. For once we seem to agree on something =). This situation has happened before on a variety of issues, from practice playing fields to sponsor's automobiles that a team can utilize. I think Karthik summed it up so I am not going to rehash it again. What I will do is leave open the suggestion, which if FIRST could do would be an incredible, incredible feat, and bring worldwide attention.

Without bringing too much information about politics and the current situation in the middle east into play, it would be absolutely beautiful if FIRST could somehow arrange a "peace" or "unity" tournament with teams from Palestine, Egypt, Turkey, or other primarily Islamic countries in the region. I am positive that there are other initiatives like this going on, not with robotics but with education and various grassroots groups, but FIRST has a real opportunity on its hands. If it were to earmark funds from various corporate sponsors, and approach, or be approached by a team from one of those countries, it'd be a perfect opportunity to show yet again that GP has a role to play that is not just within the FIRST competition. Imagine if that were pulled off. This is a huge dream at the moment, but the unity and stability of the region could be improved if some sort of exchange program was set up. Obviously there are huge logistical problems, but without going too much into detail about politics and the like, just imagine.

"I have a dream..."

Originally Posted by Karthik

This is an attitude that shows up frequently that really bothers me.

If a team can raise lots of money, they have the right to spend it any way they want. Some teams use their excess money to generously help other teams. While other teams use this to benefit their own students. Both options are very noble in my opinion.

I for one hope many North American teams take the journey to Israel. It would be an inspirational trip for all, and it would help strengthen FIRST worldwide. That seems like a more than worthwhile expense to me.

[Francis-134]

I have to say that this is probably the best way they could spend the extra $1000 in the registration fee. Kudos to FIRST.
It would be very interesting if they could get some Arab teams to come to Israel, but to me it seems highly unlikely. Maybe an Iraq team sometime in the future when things settle down.

Nevertheless, Shalom to our brothers and sisters in robotics over on the other side of the globe.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Wow. So I have a couple of comments to make about all this stuff....

First, I can't help but think that a Israeli/Palestinian team would be really, really difficult to pull off even though it's a very inspirational thing to do. Plus, programs like that have been tried before and have only met with limited success. I know it's a horribly negative comment to make in these forums, but I think it would ultimately just be a publicity stunt. Real change in the region is going to have to be a much much broader effort.

But enough politics... my second comment is that US teams travelling to Israel are going to have a seriously uphill battle. Travel costs aside, there is the problems of getting permission from school districts and parents to allow their kids to travel to a region that is not the safest in the world where they will stick out rather seriously. Plus, there's the question of getting the robot into the country, which probably isn't as cheap or easy as shipping it around the US. And all of your tools will probably have to go with your robot, as I don't think you'll be taking them with you on the plane. So that's pretty tough.

Really, though, I'm bothered by this because it's a small regional in an area with no current teams. So FIRST is funding teams in Israel, plus an expensive regional for said teams plus a very small number of other teams. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, FIRST has raised the first regional entry fee by 20%, discouraging rookie and poorer teams here in the States. One can only wonder how FIRST can afford this if they've already had to raise prices to break even already.

Don't get me wrong, I realize FIRST is doing this to inspire people worldwide. I just question the logic of an organization that does something like this when it's already having funding woes and growing pains at home.

[RoboMom]

[quote=Kevin Sevcik]

Really, though, I'm bothered by this because it's a small regional in an area with no current teams. So FIRST is funding teams in Israel, plus an expensive regional for said teams plus a very small number of other teams. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, FIRST has raised the first regional entry fee by 20%, discouraging rookie and poorer teams here in the States. One can only wonder how FIRST can afford this if they've already had to raise prices to break even already.

QUOTE]

Who ever said FIRST is funding teams in Israel?

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by RoboMom007

Who ever said FIRST is funding teams in Israel?

Well perhaps not FIRST itself, perhaps just a FIRST sponsor or someone else that could be funding teams in the rural US. or in inner-city schools. or in Mexico or Brazil. or in some other place that's less well off than most people in Israel.

[DCA Fan]

Man this is great news! An overseas regional!

FYI, I think that GM sponsors the Israel teams, since it's called "GM/Technion University Israel Regional"

[David Kelly]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

Really, though, I'm bothered by this because it's a small regional in an area with no current teams. So FIRST is funding teams in Israel, plus an expensive regional for said teams plus a very small number of other teams. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, FIRST has raised the first regional entry fee by 20%, discouraging rookie and poorer teams here in the States. One can only wonder how FIRST can afford this if they've already had to raise prices to break even already.

Don't get me wrong, I realize FIRST is doing this to inspire people worldwide. I just question the logic of an organization that does something like this when it's already having funding woes and growing pains at home.

Oh, but there ARE teams in Israel. If you refer back to one of the speeches from Mr. Lavery last year during a regional, I think it was the VCU Regional but I'm not totally sure, he mentioned that there were going to be teams in that country.

FIRST catches a lot of undeserved flack for issues that people have no clue as to what they are talking about. FIRST raising fees to fund the Israel teams? Thats an insane idea.

For those of you that do not already know, FIRST is already quite established over across the pond with the FLL. In-fact, there are FLL teams in USA, Canada, Mexico, Brazil, South Africa, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, France, Turkey, United Kingdom, Denmark, Sweden, China, Korea, and Japan. If you don't believe me, look for yourself.

If the FLL can work on the other side of the world, why can't the FRC work the same way?

It disappoints me every time somebody accuses FIRST of doing something, or not doing something, that has no backing to it. Don't bash FIRST for what you do not know.

We should applaud FIRST and be optimistic and not pessimistic about working in Israel and other parts of the word. This is a HUGE step in changing society and [i]nspiring students across the world.

[RogerR]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

...Meanwhile, back at the ranch, FIRST has raised the first regional entry fee by 20%, discouraging rookie and poorer teams here in the States. One can only wonder how FIRST can afford this if they've already had to raise prices to break even already.

Don't get me wrong, I realize FIRST is doing this to inspire people worldwide. I just question the logic of an organization that does something like this when it's already having funding woes and growing pains at home.

I seriously doubt that the teams attending the Israel regional will have to pay any less than the teams attending one in north America. they're going to be paying $6000 (or their monetary equivalent).

also, it seems as though your saying that the teams "at home" are more entitled to support than others. but if this is the case, where is FIRST's "home"? north America? the US? new Hampshire? Manchester?

[Kevin Sevcik]

I'm trying to say that I think FIRST could better pursue its stated goal of inspiring students and changing the culture by putting its money in places besides Israel. There are many other places in the world that are pretty bad off that could benefit from a program like FIRST and whose students could benefit from the inspiration and possible scholarships that FIRST could bring. The only real reason for FIRST putting money into Israel is because it is high profile and will make people feel better about what FIRST is doing. Again, I'll note that there are many countries like Mexico, Ecuador, Brazil, and others that already have FIRST teams and could benefit greatly from increased FIRST support. I just think there are better places FIRST could be focussing its efforts.

[MissInformation]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

I'm trying to say that I think FIRST could better pursue its stated goal of inspiring students and changing the culture by putting its money in places besides Israel. There are many other places in the world that are pretty bad off that could benefit from a program like FIRST and whose students could benefit from the inspiration and possible scholarships that FIRST could bring. The only real reason for FIRST putting money into Israel is because it is high profile and will make people feel better about what FIRST is doing. Again, I'll note that there are many countries like Mexico, Ecuador, Brazil, and others that already have FIRST teams and could benefit greatly from increased FIRST support. I just think there are better places FIRST could be focussing its efforts.

Alisha Wallenstein was a student on team 116 before I was on the team. I believe she is part of, if not the driving force behind FIRST being in Israel. She came back as a mentor on team 116 for the 2002-2003 season and that's how I met her. Her drive to bring FIRST to Israel is not because it's high profile. I'm not 100% sure if her job took her to Israel or if it was family or personal, but one thing I know she took with her was her love of FIRST. If there were more people like Alisha, FIRST would be everywhere.

Heidi

[white_ChocOlat8]

the thing with the school board is i think that its not really up to them i think i remember hearing that after 9/11 absolutely no out of country trips.
i dunno this may only be for Florida so correct me if I'm wrong.

[dlavery]

Wow. After reading through several of these messages, I think that a new HTML tag needs to be developed that has the effect of clearly marking text with flashing colors that correspond to the two tag values "Pure speculation" and "I actually know what I am talking about, and have facts to back it up." Then it needs to be retroactively applied to this whole thread. I am sorry if this comes across as a harsh negative statement, but a few of the posts really have me grinding my teeth right now.

Anyway, let me try to clear up a little of the confusion and incorrect information. The following items are facts -

- A private, multinational corporation is providing funding to establish 12-14 new FIRST FRC teams in Isreal for the 2005 season. I will not confirm who they are (that is their job, if they choose to do so). They are doing this through the use of their international office in Israel and local resources that are dedicated for use within that country. In other words, they are not diverting resources away from potential teams in the U.S. or any other country.

- At least one of the teams is planned to be established at a Palestinian school.

- FIRST is not funding the new teams, or the new event. They are helping with administrative support for the new event and providing information to the new teams, just like they do with every other team and regional competition.

- NASA is not funding the new teams or event, but is provinding some support for both through other mechanisms.

- The new regional competition event will be held in a compressed format, in 1-1/2 days (1/2 day set up and practice, 1 day for qualification and elimination rounds and awards). The event is scheduled to complete in time for shabbat. To make this possible, the event size will be severely limited and some changes in format are being considered.

- Under current plans, the Middle East Regional will be open to the 12-14 new Israel teams ONLY for the first year. Registration is not open to teams from outside the Middle East. This may change later, but that is the current plan.

- The increase in registration prices for the 2005 FRC competition and the existance of the new teams in Israel are completely unrelated events. Anyone who attempts to tie these two events together is completely mistaken and just making up their information.


-dave

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by MissInformation

Alisha Wallenstein was a student on team 116 before I was on the team. I believe she is part of, if not the driving force behind FIRST being in Israel. She came back as a mentor on team 116 for the 2002-2003 season and that's how I met her. Her drive to bring FIRST to Israel is not because it's high profile. I'm not 100% sure if her job took her to Israel or if it was family or personal, but one thing I know she took with her was her love of FIRST. If there were more people like Alisha, FIRST would be everywhere.

Heidi

I wasn't aware of this, and that definitely is an inspiring story. It'd be nice if there was some press release or explaination somewhere. At any rate, I agree that it's great that other people are so enthused about FIRST and are trying to spread it. I'm just questioning the decision to hold a brand new regional in a foreign country with a small number of teams that are all rookies. There are 4-5 more veteran teams in South America, so a regional could just as logically be held there.

EDIT: I'll stop now as Dave has cleared all this up very well. I hope I haven't offended him or anyone else too terribly.

[J Flex 188]

Thanks for clearing that up Dave. We realise that you didnt have to release all that information to us, but I appreciate that particularly because you did, to avoid any more speculation. Thats great news about the Palestinian team as well.

[Denman]

yes..... thanks dave

if it goes well this year i'm hoping there will be some other teams in europe spring up and maybe even a european final..... or even in england
its a pretty good thing unless it goes totally wrong or something and something really bad happens