suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

[Ken Leung]

I've spoken many times about how we shouldn't be too serious about the reputation system, but since the decision was to keep it in this forum, I think there are ways to improve it. Otherwise we might as well take it off if it does this forum nothing. There is no reason we shouldn't make it better just because we don't take it seriously.

As mentioned above, the problem with the current reputation points system is that new members will never get enough points to be any where closed to the current reputation leaders. In other words, the current system isn't very good at demonstrating the reputation ranking of the current season (whatever that ranking might mean to people). The only benefit right now is showing the top ranked people since the beginning of time, and that has its ups and downs.

The suggestion is to reduce the current ranking so new members have a chance to catch up, and there are ups and downs for that, the biggest concern being that older members who used to contribute a lot (and received big reputation points because of that) will drop away from the ranking because they might be temporary unavailable to participate in the forum in the current season. In other words new members will not know to look for these members' posts because they never heard of them before and they are no longer on the top of the list.

Here is my suggestion:

We restart the reputation count, but we don't erase the old rep points. Have archive pages of reputation points for each individual season and the overall count. This way we have an accurate rep point of recent participation, as well as the overall ranking since the beginning of this forum.

We might not like the system very much, but it was likable enough to stay around, so we might as well make it better.

[Stephen Kowski]

this has already been discussed before....nothing has come of it before.....they are just dots we aren't electing anyone with them don't worry about it....

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...4&page=1&pp=15

[Steve W]

Originally Posted by Stephen Kowski

this has already been discussed before....nothing has come of it before.....they are just dots we aren't electing anyone with them don't worry about it....

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...4&page=1&pp=15

I agree. I used to worry about my points when I first started. I found that as I made posts that people thought were good I would get points. If they didn't like them then they took them away. I still speak my mind but I try to be careful on how I say things. That is not bad. As time goes on every one will slowly get up to 11 dots if they contribute.

If there was a wish list I would say no rep for Chit Chat and allow anyone to see who gave rep to you and why. I am NOT trying to give Brandon more work. He does a great job and he really doesn't need more hassles (nice kiss up eh).

[Arefin Bari]

I personally think its a good idea (if we dont put much pressure on Brandon). Brandon has an outside life too other than taking care of us on this forum. and as far as the high reputation goes, we all know pretty well who really helps us on the forum and who doesnt. i think reputation was a good idea. but if it takes a lot of work just to change it, then i wouldnt bother asking brandon to add this on his "To do list".

[Bharat Nain]

Just wanted to chip in a little bit, by any chance if you do abandon the reputation system, keep something where you can comment on peoples posts. Sometimes you just want to give them a little message, and maybe writing a PM is too much work(Yes, I am lazy like that and a button next to posts is convenience).

[Wetzel]

Originally Posted by Bharat Nain

Just wanted to chip in a little bit, by any chance if you do abandon the reputation system, keep something where you can comment on peoples posts. Sometimes you just want to give them a little message, and maybe writing a PM is too much work(Yes, I am lazy like that and a button next to posts is convenience).

You can hover over their name and 'Send ___ a PM' is one of the options from the drop down.

As for people moving up, I was posting a lot when it started, was in the top 15 or so then stopped posting for a few months. When I came back from my sabbatical, I was a few pages down in the sort by reputation list and there were people that I didn't know above me. Now I'm back on the first page.

Is there a ceiling for amount of points that a person can hand out? A straight cap on that might be easiest for now, not that I have any idea how the system is coded.


Wetzel

[BoyWithCape195]

I seem to find that the reputation was a very good idea when it first started out. If you made a VERY good post, you would get reputation points. Now a days, it seems that if you made one post that was "ok" you would end up with reputation. One more thing is, if you sort the member list by reputation, you notice that some people have made minimal posts as in not very active, but still have high rep. points. Now a days it is a "give your friends rep and enginners that are from big teams and companies" CD Something needs to be done to the reputation system, but i dont know what...

[Greg Needel]

Originally Posted by Steve W

I would say no rep for Chit Chat .

end of argument. I have said this before in previous posts about the rep system that reputation should only be given in technical threads because when a new member comes on and is looking for help they will know who gives good information and not who does well in the caption contest.

the other idea i think would be good is to make reputation public. if people knew that everyone could see what they were saying people probably wouldn't post comments like "funny"

not to pick on joe but unless the system changes dividing people's points will not do a darn thing because people by the end of the build season will be back higher then they currently are.

basically i think that the rep system could be a useful tool especially for new members if it is changed but right now the rep system is like hugging your family (IE. you keep doing it and in the end all you get is a good feeling)

[Joe Ross]

Originally Posted by Greg Needel

not to pick on joe but unless the system changes dividing people's points will not do a darn thing because people by the end of the build season will be back higher then they currently are.

That's the point. Those people who continue to post well will rise to he top. But so will those people who just started and posted just as well.

Look at it this way, in the upcoming year it will be twice as hard for a new member to break into the ranks of the top posters. In 5 years it will be 5 times as hard.

I suggested these two methods because I think it would be fairly simple for Brandon (or even another CD programmer that knows mysql) to implement it before kickoff. I like Ken's suggestion of archiving reputation, and I really like Kevin and Steve's suggestions about tying it to the number of posts or rolling it off as time progresses.

However it is to be done, I think something should be done before January 8th.

[Aignam]

Sure, most of these arguments sound good in theory, but if you look at the first two pages of the memberlist when sorted by reputation, almost every member is a valued, helpful, respected member of FIRST/ChiefDelphi. Sure, some of your posts might get a "Haha, this deserves a few points.", but this is well made up for when you make one of those amazing posts that earns you reputation from many, many people, and you know it is a truly useful post. Things balance themselves out. I've yet to see someone entirely useless get a quasi-high reputation. It just doesn't happen. Let's put a little more faith in ChiefDelphi-ers to be able to do this for themselves---so far it's working.

As for the idea to show a Reputation / Posts ratio, that might be okay, so long as all posts in Chit-Chat are not included in post count, as that could really hurt a person's reputation. Also, the older members who already have large post counts because they have been posting long before the reputation system was incorporated would be hurt---but, then again, things would balance themselves out.

All in all, I think things are fine.

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Joe Ross

That's the point. Those people who continue to post well will rise to he top. But so will those people who just started and posted just as well.

Look at it this way, in the upcoming year it will be twice as hard for a new member to break into the ranks of the top posters. In 5 years it will be 5 times as hard.

I suggested these two methods because I think it would be fairly simple for Brandon (or even another CD programmer that knows mysql) to implement it before kickoff. I like Ken's suggestion of archiving reputation, and I really like Kevin and Steve's suggestions about tying it to the number of posts or rolling it off as time progresses.

However it is to be done, I think something should be done before January 8th.

It is possible for new posters to gain noteriety around here. Look at Kim. She is rapidly gaining sturure around here just by showing not only her curiosity of running a new team and asking alot of questions but also her experince as a mentor from years of participating in FIRST.
Plus you shouldn't come here looking to be "top poster" but to get information about what makes FIRST tick and get information from other memebers in FIRST on what works for them.
None of us joined FIRST because we want to be noted for being a top poster on some messageboard. This is just a tool to use. let's not lose perspective here.

[Joshua May]

I'm not so sure on the idea of dividing rep by people's number of posts, because I think there is an inherint skew. Looking at the reputation charts, I see that many of those with high rep have made many posts (JVN, Baker, Brandon, DJ, etc), so perhaps they have posted good information alot of times. However, there are also members at the top of the list who have not made a miraculous number of posts (Karthik, Paul Copioli, Kris Fultz, Ken Patton), so perhaps these members have made very good, information posts not-so-many times. But by taking post number into consideration, people like JVN would have much higher reps than people like Paul, who is definitely just as contributive to the FIRST community.

Besides that, looking at all 66 of the people with 11 reputation bars, I'd say that I would go over 50 of them if I ever needed help with a robot question. And just about all the others are currently students on teams who have great potential to help FIRST even more if they start mentoring. And I would turn to an extremely vast majority of these people because of what they show outside of the technical aspects of FIRST, such as friendship, Gracious Professionalism, wit, courtesy, and all such things that make people great, and these are other things that they may bestow upon the FIRST as well.

So really, I think the reputation system is fine as it is, perhaps some changes and tinkering are needed here and there, but I don't see a single person who has high rep that doesn't deserve it in at least some form. And as far as rookies making their way to the top of the reputation ladder, I don't see much of a problem. It may be hard for them to make it to the #1 spot, but myself and a few others, namely Dori, Bharat, and Billfred (sorry to point you guys out) on these forums have only been around for about a year, and have already maxed out their rep bars, and I can already see the three of these (excluding myself) contributing to FIRST in their own ways that will better the community down on.

[Max Lobovsky]

Originally Posted by Joshua May

I'm not so sure on the idea of dividing rep by people's number of posts, because I think there is an inherint skew. Looking at the reputation charts, I see that many of those with high rep have made many posts (JVN, Baker, Brandon, DJ, etc), so perhaps they have posted good information alot of times. However, there are also members at the top of the list who have not made a miraculous number of posts (Karthik, Paul Copioli, Kris Fultz, Ken Patton), so perhaps these members have made very good, information posts not-so-many times. But by taking post number into consideration, people like JVN would have much higher reps than people like Paul, who is definitely just as contributive to the FIRST community.

I think you need to check your math:

High reputation / high posts < high reputation / low posts

Those you listed with high reputation and few posts would increase their ranking. I think if reputation were to be useful at all, this would be the way to go. (Disclosure: by this system, I'd have lower ranking. I seem to have annoyed some people...)

[Ryan M.]

Originally Posted by Greg Needel

basically i think that the rep system could be a useful tool especially for new members if it is changed but right now the rep system is like hugging your family (IE. you keep doing it and in the end all you get is a good feeling)

Exactly! And I love warm fuzzy feelings.

But, I do think that the rep system helps new users. Let's take me for an example:
This thread - For this post/thread someone (And I'm thankful to this person) I got "watch how often you reply to a post...you'll be much more productive if you wait for answers then shooting into thin air."
This one word post - I got: "Useful comments, please."
Like I said, I'm grateful for those regative reps. (Obviously, those aren't the only ones I've ever gotten, but examples...)

Those types of things showed me what people look for on here and how not to just be a bump on a log. Sure, the same thing could have been achieved through a PM, but rep carries the extra weight (especially to newer users who don't get have the "CD family" feel ) of more green/grey/*gasp*red dots.

So, I like the rep system. It has it's "flaws" in that some people feel they need to have more boxes, but it encourages people to be helpful and keeps CD clean from "post count races."

[Kims Robot]

Originally Posted by BoyWithCape195

One more thing is, if you sort the member list by reputation, you notice that some people have made minimal posts as in not very active, but still have high rep. points.

I don't exactly agree with BoyWithCape, as Ed pointed out...

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

It is possible for new posters to gain noteriety around here. Look at Kim. She is rapidly gaining sturure around here just by showing not only her curiosity of running a new team and asking alot of questions but also her experince as a mentor from years of participating in FIRST.

A small number of posts doesnt necessarily mean that you arent "active." I am on the forums every day, often several times a day absorbing a lot of information. I do have what I feel is a very high ranking for a rookie to CD, but I believe this is because I choose to post only when I feel it is relavent. I of course post a few times on whim, but in general, I only post when I think I have something of value to say.

Anyways, I guess even after all the ideas in this post, I think I still remain that the reputation seems to work 99% of the time, lets focus more on making robots and less on whos who