Concerns regarding the green paneling/green shirts

[MrToast]

Originally Posted by karinka13

I'm already VERY surprised they didn't use some other kinda sensor...like radio waves...or something

Problem with that is you would have to have some sort of radio transmitter device on the Tetra (or some other such device to broadcast "I'm here!"). I know for a fact that the Tetras are going to see some heavy abuse; much more than the balls did last year. It probably wouldn't bode well for a transmitter to undergo a lot of shaking and movement. Likewise, it would be much more expensive.

Dave

[kevin.fort]

Originally Posted by MrToast

Problem with that is you would have to have some sort of radio transmitter device on the Tetra (or some other such device to broadcast "I'm here!"). I know for a fact that the Tetras are going to see some heavy abuse; much more than the balls did last year. It probably wouldn't bode well for a transmitter to undergo a lot of shaking and movement. Likewise, it would be much more expensive.

Dave

Wouldnt it be a good srategy to make your robot the color of the tetras so that all the other robots got messed up. if it really is that easy tyhen there can be some serious problems that result from that.

also i think the goal of the software is to focus on one thing and then follow that so maybe if you dont ask it to reaquire green or whatever in the middle of the run it would do just fine

[Adare180]

Originally Posted by tiffany34990

yeah i was thinking about this a lot-- for teams like swampthing and moe

but it does have to be directly in view-- hopefully it shouldn't mess things up that much

it seems like an interesting thing to do if you go against someone with that ability but as others stated it could hurt your partner

keep up the thinking ppl....

We were discussing this earlier, and I would have thought the people at FIRST would have thought this through. It seemed that in the webcast, Dave Lavery's shirt had to be pretty close to the robot. This season should be pretty intersting.

[Petey]

Originally Posted by kevin.fort

Wouldnt it be a good srategy to make your robot the color of the tetras so that all the other robots got messed up. if it really is that easy tyhen there can be some serious problems that result from that.

also i think the goal of the software is to focus on one thing and then follow that so maybe if you dont ask it to reaquire green or whatever in the middle of the run it would do just fine

I'm less worried about that than I am about my robot leaping bodily out of the ring and throttling me if it confused my blue shirt with a blue tetra.

--Petey

[bigqueue]

Originally Posted by karinka13

Now how would the judges know if it was intentional? I happen to like the color gren very much and would love to have a green bot...

I happen to know if a team in Vt that in fact has had a very nice looking Green robot. I'm sure this will be a question asked to First....it will be interesting to see what the answer is. (will teams be forced to give-up their identity color!)

-Quentin

[Al Skierkiewicz]

I am less concerned about a false trigger on the vision system from green anythings, (including humans) than I am about variations in lighting from venue to venue. When a material looks green to you it may not appear green to a camera depending on the color of the light. It may not even appear to a camera if the light is reflecting in the right way. I think that if you read the paper on visualization you might get a better handle on how this recognition works. I would think a robot would only get in trouble if it had a green stripe of approx the same height and width as the tetra and the same altitude and texture. What I am saying is test like crazy to be sure.

[NoodleKnight]

the CMU cam can't hardware adjust it's sensitivity. Physically, the CMU cam is made of two pieces, the camera and the gpu. You can adjust the camera's focus; I'm not sure what the supplied gpu can do, hardware wise. I use the CMU cam (older one) on my own robots, it's fairly sensitive to color differences until it starts loosing focus.

[Petey]

Originally Posted by bigqueue

I happen to know if a team in Vt that in fact has had a very nice looking Green robot. I'm sure this will be a question asked to First....it will be interesting to see what the answer is. (will teams be forced to give-up their identity color!)

-Quentin

Exactly--885 would lose quite a bit of their identity.

Here is the (two part) question that I posted in the forum:

Regarding <R26>: Will there be any precautions taken--or any precautions necessary--to ensure that the cameras do not become attracted to robots or humans that are colored like field elements (eg clad in red, blue, green, yellow, silver?)

Clarifying Q. 981: Even if the intent is not to distract the robot? Since the cameras can be calibrated to sense many different colors, must some colors (& if so, which) be avoided by teams in decorating their robots and themselves?

Think about it--

If 811 built their normal red robot, and a team tried to sense the red tetras, the robot would be attracted to you, wouldn't it? Similarly, if a robot was built to sense the loading dock (yellow), and they went against Buzz, the Buzz robot could be mauled, couldn't it?

Interested to hear the answer. That's just one of the 7 or so questions I posted.

--Petey

[Petey]

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz

I am less concerned about a false trigger on the vision system from green anythings, (including humans) than I am about variations in lighting from venue to venue. When a material looks green to you it may not appear green to a camera depending on the color of the light. It may not even appear to a camera if the light is reflecting in the right way. I think that if you read the paper on visualization you might get a better handle on how this recognition works. I would think a robot would only get in trouble if it had a green stripe of approx the same height and width as the tetra and the same altitude and texture. What I am saying is test like crazy to be sure.

Excellent point.

It will be difficult to test like that when you're concerned about other robots, though.

Think about it--that robot followed Dave around, and it also followed the green tetra, if I'm not mistaken. Those were wildly different greens.

--Petey

[Greg Marra]

Originally Posted by Petey

Excellent point.

It will be difficult to test like that when you're concerned about other robots, though.

Think about it--that robot followed Dave around, and it also followed the green tetra, if I'm not mistaken. Those were wildly different greens.

--Petey

I do not believe they showed the robot following a green tetra. That was only in the CG-demo and the people-demo.

[jedinite]

Well, certain members of our team, who will remain unnamed

*cough* me *cough*

have already begun a list of the top things the judges *DON'T* want to hear this year. The top of the list - "Well, it's your own fault for wearing that color. Don't blame us!"

We're just worried 'cause our shirts look like almost the same colors as the blue tetras. That might be a problem in practicing. I guess the same is true for green teams and red teams in practice matches. All I know is that I've already been instructed never to wear my tie-dye around the robot... it's already tried to get me enough times.

[Petey]

Interesting then.

I just want to see the answer.

--Petey

[Greg Marra]

Originally Posted by Petey

Interesting then.

I just want to see the answer.

--Petey

I notice a lot of people are posting about using the camera system to find "blue" and "red" and "yellow".

Really? My impression was you were just going to home into the green color that's only on the vision tetras. No need to look for other colors, the green is all you're interested in.

What was your thinking?

[Kyle]

i really don't think that the colors will have that much of an effect, i have been thinking about this alot and i have also been looking up info on the sensors and a team should be able to set the sensors to only pick up the exact color and the sensor will mostly work in the area it is pointing in, remember in the kickoff the sensor was mounted high to follow Dave, since the tetras are kinda low to the ground there shouldn't be much of a problem. at least i hope not..

[Daniel Brim]

Originally Posted by Greg Marra

I notice a lot of people are posting about using the camera system to find "blue" and "red" and "yellow".

Really? My impression was you were just going to home into the green color that's only on the vision tetras. No need to look for other colors, the green is all you're interested in.

What was your thinking?

The loading stations have vision detectable red and blue on the floor by them; and the goals all have yellow HDPE triangles under them that can also be detected by the sensor.

-Daniel