What's happening to this program???

[Weightmn]

I am someone who really believes in the FIRST program but lately with having perfume poured on my daughter as a prank at a team social and now getting news back from the Denver regional I am really floored!!!

Some teams are actually planning strategies to rip others pneumatics off, or how to do damage to others robots. One of our team members came back and told me (I am one of the mentors) about someone who wanted to make an alliance with us and their strategy was to try and damage other robots by ripping off or damaging their pneumatics. This is NOT ROBOT WARS!!!

I think people are not being taught what FIRST ROBOTICS represents or they are totally missing the point with this program. If you are in it to win at all cost and you do not mind messing up MANY, MANY long hard hours of MANY people's time- I think you should find another program such as Robot Wars and join that.

Please do not destroy other people hopes, hard work and aspirations because you have the wrong mentality for this program! FIRST is NOT about damaging others Robots! Remember "GRACIOUS PROFESSIONALISM" is what is required in this program- if you are unclear about what that is go to:
http://www.usfirst.org

[katiyeh07]

The one thing I really liked about kick-off this year is how Dave and Dean and Woodie stressed the fact that IT DOESN'T MATTER IF YOU LOOSE, becuase either way, you still built a robot out of bits in pieces in 6 weeks, and learned new things. It's about having a good time, meeting new people, sharing ideas,and learning. A trophy is a meer piece of plastic, if you value that more than everything else FIRST has to offer, then I think you may be forgetting what this program is all about.

[Koko Ed]

We go through this every year.
The old gaurd complains about how impersonal and rude and cuthroat FIRST is becomming and they proclaim. THIS IS THE END OF FIRST!
Yes there is much stress and drama present here this season with folks complaining about refs and rules and such. But it's not like people didn't complain other seasons as well.
Not everyone is going to buy into what the program is selling. Not everyone is going to want inspiration over winning. Not everyone is going to be graciously professional.
Still somehow FIRST remains a great community and a great tool for inspiring our youth, in spite of all of this. That FIRST can survive all of this strife is a true testiment to it's greatness.

[Eugenia Gabrielov]

While I may seem like a driving optimist, I will tell you that for everyone of those people that wants to rip off pneumatics or cheat in the game, there are hundreds of well-spirited ambitious teenagers and mentors who care about this program and don't do the things that you mention.

When you enter any program, athletic, academic, scientific or otherwise, there will be conflicts. FIRST isn't a perfect universe, it's not a mecca for perfectly sportsmanlike people. It's a community, and in order for the program to last there have to be problems to understand how to fix them.

I guess I'm feeling upset because of the amount of berating going on the past few weeks against some ref or some award winner, because it reflects negatively on those who want to maintain a positive attitude and influence.

Here is the solution: (edit: at least) 12 hugs a day

- Genia

[JamesBrown]

Well I do see some problems with the program but unfortunatly that is reality. Every team howver has a core who feel as though the won if the robot ships in working condition and then see competition as a showcase of their hard work and to learn from the work of others.

To show that the group isnt all bad at UTC their was a team tangled in someone elses pnuematics they could have easily pulled back their robot and risked damaging the other teams pnumatics however they instead worked with their opponent to get free without damage to the other bot. At the end of the match they apologized for the tangling and made sure they didnt do any damage

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

We go through this every year.
The old gaurd complains about how impersonal and rude and cuthroat FIRST is becomming and they proclaim. THIS IS THE END OF FIRST!
Yes there is much stress and drama present here this season with folks complaining about refs and rules and such. But it's not like people didn't complain other seasons as well.
Not everyone is going to buy into what the program is selling. Not everyone is going to want inspiration over winning. Not everyone is going to be graciously professional.
Still somehow FIRST remains a great community and a great tool for inspiring our youth, in spite of all of this. That FIRST can survive all of this strife is a true testiment to it's greatness.

A couple of further thoughts.
FIRST is no longer a program. It's an institution. The selfish acts of a few misguided individuals cannot destroy it. Hell it can't even dilute it.
Think about it: Look at professional baseball. They got labor strife, steroid scandals and economic imbalance and yet people still love the game and still go watch it.
Look at the United States. It has rampant crime and poverty, failing public school systems , an ever growing budget deficit and a supposed divide between the left and the right. And yet I dare anyone to say it's still not a great country.
This is what FIRST has become. It has taken on a life of it's own and the only thing that can kill it is a catastrophic event that would bring the end to everything (like a meteor striking the earth) or outright indifference from every participating member. Maybe in 1992 when it was starting out FIRST was touch and go but every year it has grown bigger and stronger. It may not be sweeping the nation but it's embedded in the landscape of it's conscience and it's never ever going to leave.

[DarMagi]

FIRST truley is an institution for the mere fact, where else can you go up and hug a stranger and get a hug back, and not mace in the face or put in jail for sexual harassment? Anyways, FIRST is a great program, and to all teams that looked at dirty strategies that involved damage to some parts of other robots ... shame on you all... anyways, in my opinion you are a winner if you stuck out the regional event, even if you did not compete, but spectated. In some way, every spectator has given to the FIRST community, whether it was bringing food to a team, volunteering to transport materials for field assembly, or such the likes. FIRST is a great instance of what everything should be, despite the bad apples, which is always in every scenario that we deal with as a person. I say, let them be bad, because something worst will happen to them. Like per say, their phuematic lines get ripped off by accident in the final match of nats costing their alliance the victory, which in my case, I would be really really upset, as would the other teams participating, but still would be a worthy punishment for damaging actions.

[pathew100]

These are all good comments, but a few bad apples can ruin the bushel. It's the responsibility of all the teams to play fair and to ensure that other teams are doing the same. It's not good enough to just turn a blind eye if something like that is occuring. By not doing anything it is telling that team that they can cheat and get away with it. Because to them, if no one objects, then their strategy must be ok. It's also not a good idea to point fingers and publicly call out other teams who may or may not be cheating. If you see or hear about a team that's planning to bend or break the rules or the spirit of the rules, I would suggest talking to them privately. Something along the lines of, "Do you really think that will be the best strategy? What about this?", and provide some examples of your own. We have to be able to police ourselves at times.

[Daniel Brim]

Of course we all want FIRST to be perfect. But they are human, not robots.

Keep in mind that there have been major arguments every year.

In 2002 there was the The tether issue
In 2003 there was "Collusion"
In 2004 there was "Collaboration"

The moral: FIRST will always have issues. Sometimes there will be arguments. However, as the students and mentors of FIRST, it is our job to keep this program that has touched so many lives going. I think we are just experiencing the "annual argument" and hopefully it will pass soon.

-Daniel

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by DanielBCR

Of course we all want FIRST to be perfect. But they are human, not robots.

Keep in mind that there have been major arguments every year.

In 2002 there was the The tether issue
In 2003 there was "Collusion"
In 2004 there was "Collaboration"

The moral: FIRST will always have issues. Sometimes there will be arguments. However, as the students and mentors of FIRST, it is our job to keep this program that has touched so many lives going. I think we are just experiencing the "annual argument" and hopefully it will pass soon.

-Daniel

Oh Wow! Collusion!
Now that was a hot button topic!
I don't remeber tethers being a problem til the championship and teams started getting DQed left and right on the center field (I frgot which one it was).
The collabertion issue seems so moot this year with so many examples of it this year.

[Daniel Brim]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

Oh Wow! Collusion!
Now that was a hot button topic!
I don't remeber tethers being a problem til the championship and teams started getting DQed left and right on the center field (I frgot which one it was).
The collabertion issue seems so moot this year with so many examples of it this year.

The point is that it wasn't moot last year. That argument was probably worse and more heated than the one we are having now.

Re: tethers
That was before my time, I'm just relaying a thread on it.

[Weightmn]

I haven't posted many times as you all can see and I just wanted to say "Thanks" for bringing up my spirits once again!

I agree FIRST is an institution, I stand corrected when I said program. I also agree nothing is perfect, unfortunately. I am GLAD to see such emotion when we bring up such a subject because I know deep in my heart the biggest majority of the people, kids, students, mentors involved love FIRST and what it stands for and would do and are doing the RIGHT thing. WAY TO GO...keep up the GREAT JOB!!! I know many, many of us would not have not turned a blind eye to the happenings and comments in this situation mentioned. I know I would have said something had I been there, unfortunately I was not there.

I guess when so many of us feel as strongly as we about something as good as this I know that it will be just fine. I don't think FIRST will ever die as some have written. I know it may change and evolve- has to with so many coming on board...but change is a good thing. Lot's of wonderful things come from change- I will be watching for all the great things that will come from all the new teams and ideas.

Thanks to everyone for your positive thoughts- you are all winners in my book!

[DCA Fan]

In every organization, there are a few bad eggs. In such a large institution such as FIRST, they are bound to be more noticable. But the great majority of FIRSTers understand and care for the values of Gracious Professionalism, moreso than any other organization I've been in. Mentors and students who strategize about breaking other robots will soon learn that there are first, many rules against that that the referees can call them on, and second, that FIRST first and foremost is not Battlebots.

[Termite233]

Obviously anyone would like to win. But it's not what competition should be about. i can say for most of team (though I shouldn't speak for everyone) that one of the main reasons for really trying to win is because our school doesn't really care about robotics. It seems that the more things we win, the more they actually notice us. so it's a way of motivating our team to work harder during build season and before it starts so we can be our absolute best during the competition season. I know some teams are not like this. some teams receive a lot of support from their school. but I can't speak for everyone. all I know is that I enjoy winning most because it helps get more kids involved.

[soshowtherobot]

The thing is that in every event there will be some people who don't have the word lose in their vocabulary. The thing is that FIRST made this program not to have people become winners and losers, but to train us for what it is like to work with a team, a group of people. Learn new engineering skills. This is giving us all a head start towards engineering, business, designing. One thing that our mentors have told us that once out in the corporate world you will have to know how to work together. This gives us a chance to practice out leadership skills. Also something people must realise is that the games that first designs is such that so any team can be a winner even if their robot does not even move.