Does FIRST give out too many awards? (Opinion)

[IMDWalrus]

Originally Posted by Beth Sweet

Those medals, while they may not seem like the correct form of reward, mean everything to some people.

Time for a simple question.

If the medals aren't the correct form of reward, than what is? The pins are an alternative, to be sure, but what other choices are out there that would be realistic options?

I know that that wasn't the point of your post; instead, let's consider that a question for everyone who doesn't like the medals as they are now.

[Philip W.]

These participation medals don't satisfy me either. What are they congratulating me for? For putting countless and sleepless nights into building a robot, and spending strenuous days on the greatest competition I've experienced when the other guy gets the same medal for coming into the shop every other week for an hour and goes around in the pits looking for give-aways? Everyone gets the medal no matter what they've done, whether they're the ideal and devoted FIRST participant or the guy you never knew was on the team and because of this, the participation medal has no value as an award. I suppose I can keep it to represent what I've done during the past year in robotics, but to me, the robot itself does that. I could also use it to bring back memories when I take it out of an old dusty box twenty years later, but why keep it when it's only worth 5 letters and a few words when I can keep pictures worth a thousand?

An award, may it be a medal, pin, ribbon, certificate, or even if it was words out of someone's mouth, that congratulates me in some specific way, I would value it plenty more than a participation medal. Karthik's four year pin idea is great that way, it's a specific award that commends a feat. Even the driver's pin (although I am not a driver...yet) would be worth more to me than that participation medal. An award for my work in the pits, or time spent during the build season, or during the off-season, or anything similar would be ideal. Of course, how is FIRST going to know I've done all this?

Even words are better. Having someone congratulate me on work well done is, as I said, worth more to me than a participation medal. Meeting Dave Lavery and hearing him commend me for a robot function that I've helped design and create was worth a lot more than any participation medal. Even my self-gratification is better I'd say.

[shyra1353]

Originally Posted by Beth Sweet

That being said, I disagree with most everything you are saying. You say that you (and I believe the other supporter of the concept was Karthik...) beleive that better than a participation medal would be a 4 year pin. I vehemently disagree with this concept. In fact, I still would not qualify for my 4 year pin as I've been in FIRST for only 3 years. Howerever, I feel that participating in FIRST has been fantastic on me. I know that this season, I distributed the participation medals and my 1-year seniors were so proud that one of them didn't take off his the entire evening. Those medals, while they may not seem like the correct form of reward, mean everything to some people. We worked so hard this year. Those kids were so proud of their achievements.

The way I see it, FIRST participation makes everyone winners, so there's no problem with giving a winner a medal.

I don't know, I just don't like the idea of saying that longevity is a better indicator of FIRST than the effort put forth. Maybe a yearly pin would work well, but I hate the 4 year idea. In 3 years, I feel like I've had more good things happen to me and been more impacted by FIRST than some who were in the program for 4 years that I know.

I agree with Beth. I have been in FIRST for 3 years and though I regret not joining the team in grade 9, there is nothing I can do about it now. However, FIRST affects people in all different ways. For some, it can change their lives, as it definitely has mine and the majority of the frequent posters on CD. But, there are so many other FIRST participants who haven't been affected in this way. And some of these may have been involved for their entire high school career. So while a 4-year pin is a great idea, I don't think it would suit everyone. Quality not quantity. I for sure would be extremely jealous of those who do get the 4 year pin.

And just to be difficult .. what if you spend more than 4 years in high school ??

Originally Posted by Philip W.

Even the driver's pin (although I am not a driver...yet) would be worth more to me than that participation medal.

As much as I love my participation medals, I will agree with this. Operator Badges mean a lot to me and I am so proud to say that for the last two years I have been part of the drive team.

[Lil' Lavery]

Should it be a 4-year pin, or an "every year possible" pin. People move in and out of high schools that have the program, rookie teams forms, veteran teams disband. Many people don't get the ability to be a member of a team for 4 years. That would be totally unfair to them for their acheivments not to be recognized as well.

[richardp]

Even a every year possible pin, I don't like. The problem with that is once again for the people that shied away for a year or did a year then came back after taking a year off. These members might be some of the most vital on a team (like team captain...). I like the medals, so even if for whatever reason you only do robotics one year you get a piece of hardware. Sure you will still have pictures and other items, but at least its something from FIRST.

For putting countless and sleepless nights into building a robot, and spending strenuous days on the greatest competition I've experienced when the other guy gets the same medal for coming into the shop every other week for an hour and goes around in the pits looking for give-aways

There is no way for FIRST to know how much or little each individual puts in, this seems more of a should teams give out individual awards item, since the other members of the team would know who deserves recognition for the their efforts.

[the_short1]

Originally Posted by richardp

Even a every year possible pin, I don't like. The problem with that is once again for the people that shied away for a year or did a year then came back after taking a year off. These members might be some of the most vital on a team (like team captain...). I like the medals, so even if for whatever reason you only do robotics one year you get a piece of hardware. Sure you will still have pictures and other items, but at least its something from FIRST.



There is no way for FIRST to know how much or little each individual puts in, this seems more of a should teams give out individual awards item, since the other members of the team would know who deserves recognition for the their efforts.

i agree.. cuz..what if your team didnlt win ANY awards, and that participation medal was all you had? wouldn't you fell like crap if your team puts in all those hours and not have ANYTHING to show ?

[Daniel Brim]

Originally Posted by the_short1

i agree.. cuz..what if your team didnlt win ANY awards, and that participation medal was all you had? wouldn't you fell like crap if your team puts in all those hours and not have ANYTHING to show ?

You'd still have the experience that you gained from FIRST. That's more important than anything an award can give you.

[Kims Robot]

Wow this is a really interesting thread, and the first time I have had a chance to read it. I like the points from both sides, but I was surprised to not really see this take on it yet:

Lets look at FIRST as a corporation (it really is now). What is the goal of a corporation? To get more customers. How do you do that? Produce a product that everyone wants. Now many may argue that the product is the FIRST teams themselves, and I personally agree. However, look at it from the perspective of these companies that are shelling out thousands upon thousands of dollars to support these teams. There may be individuals in the upper ranks of the corporation that "get" why the company is spending this money. But it is still a corporate world. Corporations still want tangible results. If they poured the money into a product, they often get cash back in the end. We (FIRST Teams) give them nothing but a warm and fuzzy [I will caviot this by saying that there are longer term or outside benefits such as students returning as engineers, or company marketing, but just on a year to year immediate basis its mostly the warm fuzzy]. So what is the absolute easiest way for a team to show its sponsor what it got out of the competition? An award. Teams can bring their trophies back to their sponsor who can then display them in recognition of the teams hard work. Without the trophies and banners, FIRST teams can easily be forgotten about or pushed aside.

Looking at another version of the business side of things, if you look at the big companies, a lot of them participate in programs to better the company (like the Gallup Survey). One of the big things the survey focuses on is how the employees feel about the company, and one of their big things is "Recognition." They even have a question that asks "Were you recognized for doing a good job in the last seven days?" Many companies have small individual awards that supervisors can give at any time for good performance, hard work, or something like that. These awards often come with certificates and either gift certificates or money. Recognition means a lot to a lot of people. Now, not everyone needs physical or even verbal recognition. There are people who just knowing they did something good works for them. But for the rest of us, a little pat on the back, or something that we can hang on our fridge means a lot.

I have a few certificates that I have been given hanging in my office. Does the fact that the guy in the cube across from me has the same award hanging in his cube devalue mine? Heck no! I know the effort that I put in to get mine. There is a story with EVERY award, I know my story, I'm happy my hard work was recognized.

Moving on to some of the smaller notes on individual awards... I could go on and on about why each award is important, but I will just mention two of the ones already mentioned here. The spirit award is not simply for the team that screams the loudest. We learned this when we took the award in Toronto. Yes we cheered, yes we had camo pants, yes we had a great time... but the first thing the judges mentioned was "in the spirit of help the Rochester teams, this team hosted a pre-ship rally." That had nothing to do with how much we cheered. And the Entrepreneurship Award. I think this is a great new award. Most teams try to have a leadership team, or a student handbook, or marketing or such. All fall in the category of business. We lost several students this year because we touted the fact we were going to have a business sub team, and the business got lost in the hustle to do the engineering. The business aspect can be a HUGE part of a FIRST team. This is the side of engineering that doesn't have to do with the robot, but is real to the engineering world. So I am glad they finally brought this to importance in FIRST.

Now, onto the medals... If you don't care about yours, donate it to a team that had more than 25 people and actually wanted it. I have every one of mine since they started giving them out (yikes I think that goes back to 97!). I love every one of them. I will be honest, I don't look at mine as Olympic medals, they don't mean the same to me as the gold one we got for winning Toronto. But to me they are fun mementos of every year I participated. Pins are small and get lost, medals can hang on a wall and look pretty. Maybe medals are FIRST's equivalent of Varsity letters

A story to go with the medals. My rookie team's very first competition, the Finger Lakes Regional... My kids walked into this event having NO clue what the magnitude of it was. We scrambled, we fumbled, but our robot did alright. And then we won the rookie all star award!! The team went nuts. The kids wrote an email to everyone that Sunday, they wanted all of us to go to work and school wearing our uniforms (ugh I had already worn mine for three days and spent Sunday sleeping not washing it!) and they all wore their medals to school, and took turns carrying the RAS trophy through their classes. They were thrilled they were excited, and they were proud of both the medals and the trophy.

After our sixth trophy, the kids are desperately trying to get themselves recognized like the sports teams. Each sports team has their own wall or their own trophy case... but ours sit in a box upstairs. We are hoping that the school is proud enough of our team to recognize them like it has their athletes.

These awards mean a lot to a lot of people. Whether they mean something to you is up to you. But it means a lot to the corporations, and it means a lot to the students, and it gives many of us something tangible to set our sights on. I think its great that so many teams can be recognized for so many different things.

I say the awards are great. And I love that the Boilermaker brought back the fun awards and even got the teams involved!! We should all follow that lead.

Just my very long winded thoughts

[Ashley Christine]

Wow, all this is very interesting, and I do see both sides of it all.

I really like Kims view of it, it makes a lot of sense. And I think she is fairly right.

Maybe some teams just get too many awards and dont value them the same as others.

I dont have a lot to say, and speaking after Kims long and amazing opinion it is hard to beat that! lol.

Basically all I want to say is awards or not, just have fun, all I know is when there are awards, it makes you want to push a little harder and increases quality and drive.

-Ashley