FIRST: COLLEGE ?

[Cory]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

I'd bet there are more college students (with engineering or technical majors too) than you know who have never drilled a hole or who have never picked up a screwdriver or never written a program.

Remember, not all the highschool students out there get to experience FIRST (or anything remotely similar to it) and a lot of times they get stuck in their books in college. And when they finish their education, all they have is pile of books, and a mind full of formulas, and no idea what to do with them.

I'm all for it.

Why pull mentors away from high school kids, who haven't made their career choices yet, to allow college kids (who already made their career decision) to drive robots on the field?

That's all that'd be accomplished. You might inspire a few business majors to become ME's or EE's, but it will be a disproportionally small number. With the way college is now, people are looking to get out as quickly as possible. Very very few people will be willing to sacrifice over a year of coursework for a liberal arts/business/what have you degree to switch over and work on an engineering degree. It just doesn't make sense, particularly in economic terms, and wages lost by not being in the workforce when you have to makeup that year.

The majority of the people such a competition would attract are a) kids who did FIRST in high school, or engineers at the college in question. Either way, both of these groups have already seen the message of FIRST. The only thing this would do for them is allow them to compete on the playing field, and let them have fun.

It's not worth it to entice current college mentors away from high school kids, where they can actually affect a kid's career choice, and make a difference.

$0.02

[Eugenia Gabrielov]

Adding a large number of college teams would cause sponsor and venue outsourcing, and more importantly mentor outsourcing.

Speaking from the point of view of a high school student, I look up to my college-aged advisors. It's easier for me to work with a college-aged advisor than to work with an adult I don't know, and I look up to these college students because they offer advice and information that applies to me more than the advice from any other age group.

While I agree with Sanddrag that many college students need more technical experience, I'll confess that I'd be sad to see these students go. The mentors on our team offered technical training for all new advisors, regardless of their experience in FIRST. Every new technical advisor had similar training, and ended up on the same level of technical knowledge.

There are other robotics programs, but let's keep FIRST student participatino below college age. We love you college kids.

[Lisa Perez]

Also, just because a college student has never participated in FIRST doesn't mean he or she can't get involved on a team now and be a good mentor. People of that type, like rookies to teams, always have something different and new to offer because they've never been through a build season or seen a competition.

[Kims Robot]

Plus there are already many FIRST like college competitions. There are things like Solar Car, Mini-Baja, Concrete Canoe, RoboCup, DARPA, etc. All of these probably dont have the excitement and fanfare of FIRST, but they are all short term engineering based problems. These are great programs for college students who want to get their hands dirty and solve a real world engineering problem.

And I have to agree, that the mission of FIRST is to inspire high school kids to pursue careers in science & technology. I also have to agree, inspiration does not usually come at the college age.

And while FIRST is a lot of fun as a high school student, college is a time to grow up, to learn to lead, and to learn to mentor in the FIRST community.

[Kel D]

Well, I think it sounds like an awesome idea. But I can see where everyone else is coming from. Why can't there be a college team that also mentors a FIRST team? And I think it would be a great way for college students to start networking. I got an awesome internship in high school through FIRST. I know that I had an amazing time in FIRST but I didn't get to do everything that I wanted to and didn't get learn everything about certain things that I wanted to learn more about. And I sit in my math and physics class in college and I wonder "what am I ever going to use this stuff for?" and I think something like FIRST COLLEGE would allow students to apply all this knowledge and see if we really do want to be in engineering. I dunno, I don't think that something like this goes against what FIRST is trying to promote, but maybe that's just me.

[Wetzel]

Originally Posted by Cory

Why pull mentors away from high school kids, who haven't made their career choices yet, to allow college kids (who already made their career decision) to drive robots on the field?

Because I want to, darn it!

Actually, mentor matches are awesome, in my opinion. Lets the adults have a chance to play with the toys they helped create. I got my chance this year at the Capital Clash, and it was hella fun. Now I just need to move home and help them build a mobility system that works.

Wetzel

[sanddrag]

Originally Posted by Wetzel

Because I want to, darn it!

That's reason enough for me. FIRST is fun to be involved in as an active participant. Yes I have moved on from HS, but yes I still want to build the robot, and I still want to drive, and I still want to be a human player, and do everything that the HS students do. But I can't, and that's why we need a College FIRST, not because we need it, but because we want it.

[KenWittlief]

all the college level competitions that exist now are way more interesting and challenging than anything you ever did in FIRST

and if you find you have free time on your hands in college, do what DK did - start your own company

FIRST was only a taste to get you interested. If you are attending an engineering university, you need to hurry up and get through the 7 stages of grieving over the loss of your HS years, and look ahead to your future.

[Conor Ryan]

I'm just thinking here, but everyone here is looking at a college level FRC, what about a College Level Vex Division? Since the vex season is much much shorter and cheaper it could be a place for colleges to grow. However because of the mentorship that college students provide, I'd never let a full blown robotics competition at the collegiate level take place. But maybe a Collegiate Vex, you never know after playing around with Vex you may get more mentors all of a sudden.

[Freddy Schurr]

Thats an interesting idea.