TOO much scouting info???

[Bill Moore]

If you do plan to collect a lot of information during matches, try to develop a checklist for your scouts that will collect the information easily. Then have training sessions before competition. If possible, use some of the streamed regionals if you aren't competing the first weekend.

There is nothing worse than the scouts writing out notes longhand, and having them miss half a match while doing so. (What happened? I was writing stuff down!)

[Ebolagirl]

Originally Posted by Bill Moore

If you do plan to collect a lot of information during matches, try to develop a checklist for your scouts that will collect the information easily. Then have training sessions before competition. If possible, use some of the streamed regionals if you aren't competing the first weekend.

There is nothing worse than the scouts writing out notes longhand, and having them miss half a match while doing so. (What happened? I was writing stuff down!)

It's interesting that you mention scout training. Our team competes in another robotics competion in the fall and I actually used that competition as a pseudo-introduction to scouting. I didn't get to train and organize as much as I would have liked because I had other responsibilities, but at least it gave the newbies a taste of scouting.

[lukevanoort]

It's all good and well to use points scored as a criterea, but don't do what a lot of teams do and overlook defense when you're planning.

From what I saw, (I didn't scout) our team's scouting was messy and slow. The papers ended up in a big messy pile and was hard to read the writing at times, also the team members had trouble seeing the field. This year, binoculars and (maybe) a database (if I get around to learning acess) run on a 802.11b network with better dbi directional antennae for pit <--> stands communication. But, then we need the school to lend us ten(ish) laptops. Ideally I'd get a decent camera and film all the matches and connect it to a high capacity server/media center computer, before you mention the instant replay thread, remember, we aren't making juding calls on who's zip ties are in the triangle here, just deciding strategy, which (I think) doesn't need as good resolution.

[Danny Diaz]

Originally Posted by lukevanoort

It's all good and well to use points scored as a criterea, but don't do what a lot of teams do and overlook defense when you're planning.

True, it's the complete picture you're looking for. I know we've run the gambit as far as good ways to characterize a team and bad ways to characterize a team - one thing I especially note is that team members like to tell you they can give you the world (if picked) and end up doing nothing on the field. Noting what they say they can do and what they actually do (and how they do it) is critical, but as many people have said already it comes down to what info your drivers have when it comes time to pick. Ebolagirl had a good point - drivers have usually seen nothing, and all your scouting data is useless without some kind of way to say, "Pick this team if they're available." Having tons of raw data from the scouts is kinda useless without a rubric for scoring that data, and then it turns into a matter of how well the rubric was designed. In the end it's all about gut feeling anyway; at least at Lone Star when it comes time to pick the third alliance member there are a large pool of qualified teams who all rank very similar - how do you know who to pick then?

-Danny

[Ian Curtis]

Why tape all the matches? Way too messy, unless you have a lot of tapes, and generally lacking quality to see what's going on with everyone.

The MOST IMPORTANT thing you can have is a picture of a robot. Really. With a few simple stats you'll be golden becuase pictures say a thousand words. Also usually there'll be one person in your scouting crowd who knows every team and their robot, or collectively you'll be able to do that.

[Ebolagirl]

Originally Posted by iCurtis

Why tape all the matches? Way too messy, unless you have a lot of tapes, and generally lacking quality to see what's going on with everyone.

The MOST IMPORTANT thing you can have is a picture of a robot. Really. With a few simple stats you'll be golden becuase pictures say a thousand words. Also usually there'll be one person in your scouting crowd who knows every team and their robot, or collectively you'll be able to do that.

I agree. There is no reason to tape all the matches. For one thing, there won't even be time to watch them before having to come up with a list for the captain. Our team takes picture of every single robot to use as references for ourselves and visuals for the drive team. http://www.lasarobotics.org/gallery/...ST-Scouting-05 That is a link to our photo gallery where we posted some of our scouting photos from Lone Star Regionals. And yes, there is always one scout that knows who every single team is.

[Bill Moore]

Originally Posted by Ebolagirl

I agree. There is no reason to tape all the matches. For one thing, there won't even be time to watch them before having to come up with a list for the captain.

Actually, taping your own robot can help in reviewing the match with the competition team to discuss the strategy they were using at different points. This may change how they react to a similar situation later.

[Ethulin]

Nope. I see no way it is possible you can collect to much data. The more data you have available to you the more accurate your results/predictions will be.

I do however see how someone with so much data could not concentrate their efforts on the most important parts of the data, so I suggest some serious prioritizing of data.

Over at STAMP stampscouting.org we work really hard to prioritize our data so with a small team of scouters you can get the best "bang for your buck" so to speak with your scouting.

Also, using the videos NASA provides for regionals is well... crappy for scouting. They are horrible at giving a complete picture of the match and spend 30 seconds watching a downed robot squirm on the ground. It is not their fault, they are not trained like ESPN camera men who know exactly how to follow play and predict where the next major point of action will be. They also do not have access to 20 different cameras in different positions.

[Cyberguy34000]

Personally I view scouting as 2 part

1: Collecting and gathering as much relevant data as possible
2: Organizing and compiling this data into a useful format that is useable by team leaders (E.G. Drivers and such)

Yeah you can go overboard on part 1, collecting a crapload of irrelivant data, as much as you can overboard with part 2, organizing a bunch of irrilivent data that doesn't apply to your team.

There's many different ways to scout, all have their pros and cons, but it ultimately comes down to those two parts. If your team is capable of something extreme, go for it! Just be sure that you have enough manpower and time to compile all that data into something useable. A classic rookie mistake is to go overboard on the scouting and then all they have to show for it is a massive jumble of handwritten notes. Drivers can't use that . On the other hand having someone just call stuff off the top of their head for teams and stratigies usually doesn't work too well either. Ultimately all that matters is that you take lots of data and organize it.


So can team's collect too much information? Not if they can organize it

[pyroslev]

My prefered method was to walk through the pits first to see what was around, on the second time through, gather data and fill in sheets. After that, find some friends and compare data and then watch matches to see if my data was valid before i record it all in a database.

One of the mentors found the method to be flaud, but it let me see who was being kind and profressional (if they were honest).

That's just the method i used for four years

[psycho7]

taping your opponents? good idea, but very time consuming. the way I learned to scout is to have a pit form and a stand form. fill out these forms for every time and then have a folder bin to put all the papers in by team, very organized and you can tell each team does and how they are doing by pulling out the papers you have on them quickly.

and there is no such thing as too much info, EVER! the issue is the time:info ratio that people think means too much info