2006 Official Game Hint Discussion

[Doug G]

Originally Posted by phrontist

That would be interesting, but I doubt it will happen. How would you test your code during the build season? ... I hope auto is at the end and worth a lot of points this year. Please dave, pleeeease?

There's no way FIRST would put Auto mode at the end of a match. Until we have a competition year in which 80-90% of the teams actually participate in Auto mode - it will stay as is. I bet the CMU camera will be back though, and this time, I bet a lot of teams can have more success with it. Who knows maybe we'll get two cameras this year?

[RbtGal1351]

Originally Posted by Doug G

There's no way FIRST would put Auto mode at the end of a match. Until we have a competition year in which 80-90% of the teams actually participate in Auto mode - it will stay as is. I bet the CMU camera will be back though, and this time, I bet a lot of teams can have more success with it. Who knows maybe we'll get two cameras this year?

hmm, that's what I originally thought.

Unless... there's some rule against blocking teams from getting to their (known?) autonomous starting spot?

<random thought> Boy... getting off the bar from 2004 during autonomous for tons of points would be interesting </random thought>

[Nuttyman54]

awsome idea, but the game hint says "tangling WITH pasta" not OVER....pity tho, b/c that would be awsome

[Gundamx92000]

Originally Posted by Henry_Mareck

I cant remember anyone pointing this out : what if the 5 'bots tangling over pasta means that they are tangling above the pasta. this means that the pasta is not the cause of the tangle, and may not be a game piece but just a structural component of my friend, the truncated pyramid. Again, this may have been mentioned already, but if it has it has not been given much thought.

post 445 near the top

[Soapie 108]

This might seem obvious and/or have been mentioned already, but I was thinking that a "game piece obsessed with a shovel's show" would mean that the way in which the game piece was SCORED would have to do with a shovel's show, not the shape of the game piece itself.

[Elgin Clock]

I have a question for you all.

Would there be enough of a coincidence, and/or could it possibly be that a clue could link to a long time supplier/sponsor of the FIRST program in some out of the box kind of way?

If you think yes, I have this to offer you.

Looking at the latest UFH I see Tony and Bob from IFI. (which just so happened to be the 49th UFH - interesting number )

Anyways, I instantly think Tony (I am told he is the one on the left in that picture - please forgive me if I am wrong, I have never met them) looks like a familiar face, so I Google a movie I have seen and come up with an actor's name.

Joe Mantegna is the person I was thinking of.

Now, I saw this as just another person who looks like a celebrity and a pretty cool way to remember what Tony looks like, until I reflect back to the clue.

"seeing Montana's green heights"

Most people think Montana = Joe Montana in that equation.

Joe Montana (sounds like) Joe Mantegna. Anyone catch that one yet?

I remember Joe Mantegna from a movie called Liberty Heights.
There is that word heights.

In that movie, Joe's character buys a Mist Green Cadillac.
There is that word green again.

One famous Liberty is of the Bell shaped variety.
Bell game pieces?

Oh yeah, and the UFH award to Tony and Bob was awarded 5 days before Kickoff.
There is the five from the clue as well!


Just some things to ponder.


4 more days.


Oh, and Tony, I hope you are a good sport about this, and take this as a compliment/joke/another FIRSTers crazy random thoughts in this anxious week leading up to the six weeks of craziness of another season, and nothing more.

Thanks!

[K.Shaw]

that is crazy elgin! haha the coincidence is uncanny

[Katy]

I think perhaps the larger problem with an autonomous period at the end would be having the drivers let go of the controls on time...imagine it. Pairs of tense high school students their sweaty hands wrapped around the controllers in a death grip praying their robot will make it that last five inches...four...three...two...

...and then a little noise comes and they all gracefully let go of their controls and let their robots move into autonomous mode?

Erp...I can imagine quite a few judge/driver disagreements on "was the driver touching the controls or not"

I find the truncated pyramid very interesting. The sides make me wonder however. Either the incline on the sides would have to be very shallow or the robots would have to be very clever to hang on without damaging the playing piece but at the same time not roll off when the power is cut.

This makes me think...what if the sides were also flat and the playing piece looked like steps instead?

This also fits with the idea of "show" or third place. In the Olympics and such winners stand on a series of platforms. The winner stands in the middle on a higher stand while the second and third place winners stand on shorter platforms on either side. This configuration is a pretty good match to the profile of what the playing piece could look like if the sides of the truncated pyramid were changed to flat planes that were lower steps.

The top view would look just the same as the top view of the truncated pyramid. The side view would look like a shape from tetris...don't know a better way to describe it.

Anyway...I'm not sure how that looks like a shovel but...it fits most of the other requirements.

[Bharat Nain]

Originally Posted by Elgin Clock

I have a question for you all.

Would there be enough of a coincidence, and/or could it possibly be that a clue could link to a long time supplier/sponsor of the FIRST program in some out of the box kind of way?

If you think yes, I have this to offer you.

Looking at the latest UFH I see Tony and Bob from IFI. (which just so happened to be the 49th UFH - interesting number )

Anyways, I instantly think Tony (I am told he is the one on the left in that picture - please forgive me if I am wrong, I have never met them) looks like a familiar face, so I Google a movie I have seen and come up with an actor's name.

Joe Mantegna is the person I was thinking of.

Now, I saw this as just another person who looks like a celebrity and a pretty cool way to remember what Tony looks like, until I reflect back to the clue.

"seeing Montana's green heights"

Most people think Montana = Joe Montana in that equation.

Joe Montana (sounds like) Joe Mantegna. Anyone catch that one yet?

I remember Joe Mantegna from a movie called Liberty Heights.
There is that word heights.

In that movie, Joe's character buys a Mist Green Cadillac.
There is that word green again.

One famous Liberty is of the Bell shaped variety.
Bell game pieces?

Oh yeah, and the UFH award to Tony and Bob was awarded 5 days before Kickoff.
There is the five from the clue as well!


Just some things to ponder.


4 more days.


Oh, and Tony, I hope you are a good sport about this, and take this as a compliment/joke/another FIRSTers crazy random thoughts in this anxious week leading up to the six weeks of craziness of another season, and nothing more.

Thanks!

Elgin, I have never seen any other FIRSTer so enthusiastic about solving the clue. You just proved how FIRST is a combination of the craziest people with the craziest ideas.

[JoelP]

Originally Posted by Katy

...and then a little noise comes and they all gracefully let go of their controls and let their robots move into autonomous mode?

Erp...I can imagine quite a few judge/driver disagreements on "was the driver touching the controls or not"

Well, the controls are disabled during autonomous, so it wouldn't really matter if the drivers were still thrashing away at the controls like maniacs or not.

[dhitchco]

Ya just gotta luv and admire the creativity of everyone responding. This thread has made my new year start off with a good laugh.

I concur with many of you who think that the "noodles" will become game pieces not obstacles...why?
safer and more lightweight than the tetras
industructable (lots of tetra repairs last year)
easy-to-source (less parts shortage for PVC pipes than last year)

I also consur with those of you who think that these game pieces might be stored in some sort of a "bowl" on the field where the robots have a "feeding frenzy" to grab the pasta noodles...what might eb interesting is individual competition, but with two appliance "home bowls" where 1,2,3, or even 4 teams could stash their retrieved noodles?

I also concur that "green mountains" might be carpeted & ELEVATED elements on the playing field; maybe even visualized by the camera during auto mode to climb a ramp of some sort? Auto mode MUST remain at the beginning of the round for all the reasons you have stipulated.

ps: Wal-Mart is already sold-out of swimming pool noodles.......ha, ha, just kidding. Wait until Sunday!

[ggoldman]

Montana's Green heights:

Montana Green is an actual evergreen plant. According to the link below, it has an ultimate height of 20'. It seems to me that they like having us reach tall

Edit: do a search for montana green


Look Here

Addition # 2: Noodles---

Upon a froogle search for Noodles -- I found that they are a very popular style of golf balls....something else to think about.


Happy clue hunting!!

Gabriel Goldman

On my way to PhD in mechanical engineering ....5 more years!!

[dez250]

Hungry Hungry Hippos?

[Katy]

Originally Posted by JoelP
Well, the controls are disabled during autonomous, so it wouldn't really matter if the drivers were still thrashing away at the controls like maniacs or not.

The thing is that (supposedly) if you hit the reset button a whole bunch of times in autonomous you can regain control of the robot. I believe that is why the rule was made in 2003 that the drive team has to stand a given distance from the controls.

[Zach Purser]

Originally Posted by dhitchco

Auto mode MUST remain at the beginning of the round for all the reasons you have stipulated.

Um... still not buying it. What were the reasons?

- The students would not release the controls on time: 1)The controls are useless in autonomous mode unless you alter some of the code that is not supposed to be altered, and even then I'm not sure if the controls will work. It could easily be verified if you have altered inappropriate code by having the robot set to autonomous mode and allowing a ref to try to controls to see if the robot responds in any way. 2) There could be a brief 2 second pause between driver mode and autonomous mode until all the drivers released their controls. We've had this the other way around in previous years to allow for the judges to evaluate what goals were accomplished in autonomous mode.

- Too hard to program: We have already seen examples from Vex of how the autonomous coding can be made easier.

- Not enough teams use auto mode: I think 95% of the teams at our regional last year (and it was the first round of regionals) had some form of auto mode by the end of the practice day.

- There would have to be a rule against blocking teams from getting to their known starting point: No way! I can make a deaf, blind, stupid robot drive into a corner from any point on the field, just drive one direction long enough to hit something, turn 90 degrees and drive long enough to hit something else, lather, rinse, repeat. The kit usually includes contact switches, IR-sensors, probably a gyro, and a camera. It's not hard to find your way to a known point as long as you choose a proper known point. You drive into a wall until you square up and you know you are either looking directly down or across the field of play.

Besides, you don't have to have people setting up the field in random orientations if you have the autonomous mode at the end. The randomness is already introduced by everything that has been done during regular game play.

Feel free to dismiss this idea if you want, but at some point, even if it's not this year, we will see autonomous modes that are not at the start of the match.