Go to Post The bottom line is, what works best for YOUR team is what the best solution is. - EricH [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > FIRST > Rumor Mill
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #31   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 02:18
Mr. Freeman Mr. Freeman is offline
Put better title here.
AKA: Kellan
no team (CSM Robotics)
Team Role: Programmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 198
Mr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to behold
Re: 10 Balls per second?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik
Well it's certainly theoretically possible. A ball going 12 m/s has 15 J of energy. At peak power, the small CIMs put out 340W. So if you transferred energy 100% efficiently, you could actually fire off 22 balls per second...
(I didn't actually run these numbers) But if you did run the CIM that fast then wouldn't the first balls out exceed the 12 m/s speed limit?

On another note, I also hear machinery running during the film. I can hear a soft "thump thump thump thump" before they start appearing on screen and traveling towards the hoop. Presumably noise made from exiting the shooting mechanism.
__________________
"Time is an illusion, lunchtime doubly so."
-Douglas Adams
“Why is it that I can walk into Wal-Mart and buy boxes of bullets and black powder, but I can’t buy potassium perchlorate to do science because it can also be used to make explosives?”
-Theodore Gray
Reply With Quote
  #32   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 02:29
Henry_Mareck's Avatar
Henry_Mareck Henry_Mareck is offline
Registered User
FRC #0418 (Purple Haze / LASA Robotics)
Team Role: Student
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 99
Henry_Mareck is a jewel in the roughHenry_Mareck is a jewel in the roughHenry_Mareck is a jewel in the rough
Send a message via AIM to Henry_Mareck
Re: 10 Balls per second?

* This Robot powered by Divine Intervention *

(and WD - 40 )
Reply With Quote
  #33   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 13:00
MadEyeMechie's Avatar
MadEyeMechie MadEyeMechie is offline
Mechanical Mentor
AKA: Dane
FRC #1552 (NHS Cougar Bots)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boulder, Colorado
Posts: 6
MadEyeMechie is on a distinguished road
Sure.....but

keep in mind that it will take a while to spin up a wheel to 1750 RPM, so by the time it speeds up you may only have a second or two to shoot all the balls. Total time to shoot 10 balls is not 1 second, but 1 second plus the time to speed up the wheel (perhaps almost 10 seconds depending on how you design your system)

Yes, if you just let a wheel go at the full speed of the large CIM it may provide too much velocity, but it depends on the wheel diameter (well, actually the radius really).

My calculations (which I will not post here) show that you have to be a bit careful with the diameter and inertia. However, there will be plenty of energy in the wheel to fire off a bunch of balls (remember, its not just the motor power that is shooting the balls, but mostly the energy already stored in the wheel which is really a flywheel). Its almost a given that you will have plenty of energy to shoot all the balls when your wheel is up to adequate speed to give you the velocity that you want.

You might want to consider gearing for the wheel as well - my calculations show a real benefit to this (but you will have to figure out just what it is). I will leave it to you to do the energy, inertia, speed, and power calculations.

Dont forget that the velocity of the balls will be slightly different as well since as the wheel slows down with each shot, the subsequent shots will be a bit slower,which means that the range will make a difference as to how many balls you can actually get into the goal when shooting them that fast.
Reply With Quote
  #34   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 13:38
Nuttyman54's Avatar
Nuttyman54 Nuttyman54 is offline
Mentor, Tactician
AKA: Evan "Numbers" Morrison
FRC #5803 (Apex Robotics) and FRC #0971 (Spartan Robotics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Seattle, WA/Mountain View, CA
Posts: 2,139
Nuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond reputeNuttyman54 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Nuttyman54
Re: Sure.....but

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadEyeMechie
keep in mind that it will take a while to spin up a wheel to 1750 RPM
Not really...the regular CIMs spin somewhere between 3000 and 5000 rpm, and you can spin them up (attached to a 6" wheel) in less than a half second. If you're gearing it with sprockets or using a heavy wheel then yes it will take longer, but i don't think it'll take more than a second or two
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #35   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 18:18
Lil' Lavery Lil' Lavery is offline
TSIMFD
AKA: Sean Lavery
FRC #1712 (DAWGMA)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 6,642
Lil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Lil' Lavery
Re: Mind tricks on CD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdexp
The question is, why would you risk taking too much power for a risky shot of ten balls in a sceond?
You'd be wasting balls, not really power. It doesn't take that much more power from the launcher to launch 10 at that rate. They only have to run the device for 2-3 seconds top maybe to launch 10 balls, including acceleration. To launch 1, you reallistically couldn't cut it off in under a second, especially factoring in acceleration. In fact it's probably far less energy than having to re-accelerate the motor after each shot or spacing the balls out so they shoot rougly 1 per second. The same pretty much applies for whatever feeding mechanism you use. Rate of fire has alot more to do with how you feed the balls (or prevent them from being fed pre-maturely, aka when the motors are accelerating up to speed) than the launcher itself.
__________________
Being correct doesn't mean you don't have to explain yourself.
Reply With Quote
  #36   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 18:26
gondorf's Avatar
gondorf gondorf is offline
inventor/solidworks engineering spe
AKA: stephen truscott
FRC #1733 (The Polar Bots)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: worcester
Posts: 165
gondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to behold
Re: 10 Balls per second?

what i might want to ask is with this mirical and ingenious shooter mechanism, how are the balls aimed. can the camera sync with that many shooters?

this is just a question.

also this mechanism: does it use pneumatics as a feeder? it seems like the nly thing fast enough.

jury rig wheels to the bottom. that would make a killer robot that would probably win
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #37   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 18:27
JBotAlan's Avatar
JBotAlan JBotAlan is offline
Forever chasing the 'bot around
AKA: Jacob Rau
FRC #5263
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Riverview, MI
Posts: 723
JBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond reputeJBotAlan has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to JBotAlan Send a message via Yahoo to JBotAlan
Re: 10 Balls per second?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nuggetsyl
2. you can hear the balls but nothing shooting them
Actually, I do hear a sort of dull thud right before the balls come flying, and it sounds like its real...but I'm going to say there is no bot that can pull this off.

Like you said, they look like they are falling down. For them to be doing that, they would have to be exceeding muzzle velocity constraints. And the shot is very jerky, like it was sped up.

I dunno for sure, but I'm pretty sure this is fake.

Sorry if its real, so offense...

JBotAlan
__________________
Aren't signatures a bit outdated?
Reply With Quote
  #38   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 18:35
Michelle Celio's Avatar
Michelle Celio Michelle Celio is offline
dream. belive. accomplish.
no team
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Kissimmee, Florida
Posts: 1,691
Michelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond reputeMichelle Celio has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 10 Balls per second?

just from watching it with out sound it looks like its been made faster and played backwards. and as for the upside down part, unless they put a light on the floor, how do you explain the glimse of light at the top?

I think its real but a tad bit altered and not mounted on a robot.

But then again it could be anything
__________________
UCF History & Education '12
Sometimes you just need to step away
"They were shown as everything is shown, for, like the lens of a camera, history is a force that does not discriminate."
JRW <3
Volunteering: IRI - Reset 07/08, Mission Mayhem 07 - Referee
TnT - Referee 07/08, FLL Florida State Tournament - Judge 08/09
Florida Regional 08 - Reset/Repair, Florida Regional 09/10 - Photographer
8 Events - Web Evaluator 08/09/10

Last edited by Michelle Celio : 15-01-2006 at 18:37.
Reply With Quote
  #39   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 18:39
JoeXIII'007's Avatar
JoeXIII'007 JoeXIII'007 is offline
Pragmatic Strategy, I try...
AKA: Joeseph Smith
FRC #0066
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Rookie Year: 2001
Location: Ypsilanti, MI (Ann Arbor's shadow)
Posts: 753
JoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond reputeJoeXIII'007 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to JoeXIII'007
Re: 10 Balls per second?

Ok, this is a little suspicious.
The balls are coming from the same area, there was a slight delay between the first and last balls, and there was a lot of static noise in the video.

I'm going to theorize that 968 decided they had a little spare time at the end of their day, parked something in front of the goal other than a robot, and then let it rip.

Yet again, that's just a theory. Good luck to 968 and all teams! This game will prove to be interesting when it comes time for competition.

-Joe
__________________
Joeseph P. Smith
jpthesmithe.com
University of Michigan - Informatics (B. Sci. 2012)
General Purpose Programmer - Cooperative Institute for Limnology and Ecosystems Research (CILER) at NOAA-GLERL
Reply With Quote
  #40   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 19:03
Lil' Lavery Lil' Lavery is offline
TSIMFD
AKA: Sean Lavery
FRC #1712 (DAWGMA)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 6,642
Lil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond reputeLil' Lavery has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Lil' Lavery
Re: 10 Balls per second?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gondorf

also this mechanism: does it use pneumatics as a feeder? it seems like the nly thing fast enough.
It could be gravity fed
__________________
Being correct doesn't mean you don't have to explain yourself.
Reply With Quote
  #41   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 19:21
gondorf's Avatar
gondorf gondorf is offline
inventor/solidworks engineering spe
AKA: stephen truscott
FRC #1733 (The Polar Bots)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: worcester
Posts: 165
gondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to behold
Re: 10 Balls per second?

actually i dont think gravity would be fast enough to feed at THAT speed.
i mean doesnt gravity have a limit? it would already have to be moving downward to hit that velovity to feed them in that fast.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #42   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 19:25
Travis Covington's Avatar Unsung FIRST Hero
Travis Covington Travis Covington is offline
Engineering Mentor
FRC #0254
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Rookie Year: 1998
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 574
Travis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond reputeTravis Covington has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Travis Covington
Re: 10 Balls per second?

Not nearly as many nor as fast....
__________________
-Travis Covington

2008-2017 - Engineering Mentor of Team 254
2001-2008 - Engineering Mentor of Team 968
1998-2001 - Mechanical Director/Driver/Member of Team 115
Reply With Quote
  #43   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 19:26
gondorf's Avatar
gondorf gondorf is offline
inventor/solidworks engineering spe
AKA: stephen truscott
FRC #1733 (The Polar Bots)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: worcester
Posts: 165
gondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to beholdgondorf is a splendid one to behold
Re: 10 Balls per second?

actually this mechanism would be perfect defense.

it could shoot balls straight up and catch them and just park in the center goal and knock out any balls shooting for the goal by bouncing them against one another.
__________________


Last edited by gondorf : 15-01-2006 at 19:33.
Reply With Quote
  #44   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 21:15
greencactus3 greencactus3 is offline
occra 23.
AKA: ryo
None #1481
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: North Farmington, MI
Posts: 1,523
greencactus3 is a name known to allgreencactus3 is a name known to allgreencactus3 is a name known to allgreencactus3 is a name known to allgreencactus3 is a name known to allgreencactus3 is a name known to all
Send a message via AIM to greencactus3 Send a message via MSN to greencactus3
Re: Sure.....but

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadEyeMechie
keep in mind that it will take a while to spin up a wheel to 1750 RPM, so by the time it speeds up you may only have a second or two to shoot all the balls. Total time to shoot 10 balls is not 1 second, but 1 second plus the time to speed up the wheel (perhaps almost 10 seconds depending on how you design your system)
compressed air assist?
Reply With Quote
  #45   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 15-01-2006, 21:18
Mr. Freeman Mr. Freeman is offline
Put better title here.
AKA: Kellan
no team (CSM Robotics)
Team Role: Programmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 198
Mr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to beholdMr. Freeman is a splendid one to behold
Re: Sure.....but

Quote:
Originally Posted by greencactus3
compressed air assist?
Doesn't it take time to compress the air as well?

EDIT: actually now that I think about it I remember something about being allowed to start with the tanks full.
__________________
"Time is an illusion, lunchtime doubly so."
-Douglas Adams
“Why is it that I can walk into Wal-Mart and buy boxes of bullets and black powder, but I can’t buy potassium perchlorate to do science because it can also be used to make explosives?”
-Theodore Gray
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
POLL: have small balls been abandoned? Solace General Forum 44 04-09-2004 17:53
New Jersey Regional Status Aignam Regional Competitions 144 21-07-2004 17:04
Thoughts on the competiton balls Petey Regional Competitions 26 14-03-2004 09:31
Team 188 Pictures - four big balls anyone? archiver 2001 6 24-06-2002 01:03
Will ANYONE mess with the black balls? archiver 2001 0 23-06-2002 22:35


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 20:10.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi