Recommended Tools and Machinery for Your Team's Machine Shop

[dlavery]

Originally Posted by DeepWater

The bottom line is either way if you get a lathe then about a week later you will want a mill and vice-versa.

...and that is fundamental truth number four!

-dave

[ChuckDickerson]

OK, just so there is no confusion concerning the Rong-Fu mills being discussed here are the links to Penn Tools who sell the true Rong-Fu mill/drills:

So-So: RF-25 1HP 110V 1 Phase $975

Good: RF-31 2HP 110/220V 1 Phase $1150

Better: RF-40 $2195

Best: JFC-45 1.5HP 110/220V 1 Phase $2595

You probably want to stay away from the 3-Phase power units.

Again, there are other places that sell the real Rong-Fu or lesser quality knock-offs including Enco, Grizzley, Wholesale Tools, and others.

So for your $5000 you should be able to get EITHER a nice benchtop Rong-Fu mill/drill and tooling OR a benchtop lathe and tooling but probably not both unless you went with the small 7x lathes and mini-mills from Harbor Freight, etc. or found some good used equipment locally. Just don't underestimate the cost of tooling and accessories.

Mr. Lavery, do you have any opinions on the JET line of these benchtop mill/drills and lathes. Are they good quality or in the cheap knock-off category? I have no experience with JET tools and am curious. Examples: JET mill/drills (bottom 3) and JET Lathe. The JET mill/drills seem more expensive than the comparable real Rong-Fu RF-25/31 mill/drills but the lathes seem pretty reasonable price-wise. I am just wondering about the quality. Our machine shop sponsor is looking into getting one of these JET lathes before next season.

[sanddrag]

Is this Harbor Freight model actually a Rong Fu? http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=33686 Looks similar. I can get this one for $720 new.

Also, can someone explain to me the difference of round column versus dovetail column? I've only used old large bridgeports, no small machines. I read somewhere that on the round column if you move the Z position you lose your X and Y position. This isn't true is it?

Also, are there any mills already equipped with DRO or any inexpensive DRO packages.

I saw a Jet full size mill (sits on floor) with DRO for $3500 that seemed attractive but that's a bit out of our price range.

If we bought machining equipment, we'd probably want a mill and a lathe. Although I'm guessing the lathe capacity wouldn't need to be so large.

[ChuckDickerson]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

Is this Harbor Freight model actually a Rong Fu? http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=33686 Looks similar. I can get this one for $720 new..

Oh no! That mill/drill is not a true Rong-Fu but one of the cheap knock offs that Dave was talking about in his lengthy post above. It is far less quality built and will likely have significant backlash in the leadscrews and pretty poor castings and an uneven table. You would be much better off with a used mill than one of those.

Originally Posted by sanddrag

Also, can someone explain to me the difference of round column versus dovetail column? I've only used old large bridgeports, no small machines. I read somewhere that on the round column if you move the Z position you lose your X and Y position. This isn't true is it?

Yep that's true, more or less. A round column is like a drill press. You know how when you move the table on a drill press up or down on the column it is almost impossible to get it exactly the same? It is the same on a round column mill/drill. A dovetail/square column mill drill allows the distance between the table and the head to be adjusted without loosing the setup alignment.

Originally Posted by sanddrag

Also, are there any mills already equipped with DRO or any inexpensive DRO packages.

Would you be inclined to make one yourself? Check out the Shumatech DRO-350. There is also a Yahoo group for the Shumatech DRO-350 project. Do a little research about it and you may be surprised. It's a pretty neat project if you are so inclined.

[Maniac_Mechanic]

I am a senior FIRST member. My school is fortunate enough to still have a metal shop. I know the traditional argument is that a lathe should be purchased before a mill, but let me give you my experience.

We definitely use our milling machine a lot more than the lathes. Cutting keyways is not a chore for the lathe. Milling slots in tubing for retracting arms is not for the lathe. Many of the round things we use in robotics can be purchased easily.

Custom shaft couplings for different sized shafts- if you don't have these on hand, they can be made on a lathe quickly and for a fraction of retail price. Saving time is huge bonus in this game.

If you do lots of work with gears or anything that spins, drilling true holes in the center of something must be done on a lathe for the close tolerances of gearboxes and such.

I have a lathe at home. I've done threading work on it for robotics parts. You need a lathe for cutting obscure thread sizes.

[brynnanotbrenda]

Our shop has most of the basics (drill press, laithe, chop saw, pole bender, sander, mill, ect.) so if we had to go in for something, we'd probably go for the Shopbot or a hobby laser. The only problem with that is that that would probably put me out of the job. So I'm pretty fine with the things we have.

[Bill_Hancoc]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

Is this Harbor Freight model actually a Rong Fu? http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=33686 Looks similar. I can get this one for $720 new.

i agree with the person above me on this one. I dont know brands off hand but i do shop @ harbor frieght often <happy>they just opened one 15 mins from my house</happy> and they are great for small tools and other hand tools for the team but large tools that would be used often and take much "abuse" (not in a negative way but just use) will wear out quickly. So stick to a more reputable brand what ever you choose.

[Kingofl337]

We make mills and lathes for educational purposes. We use the Prolight 3000 and 1000 with out first team.


http://www.intelitek.com/products/menu.asp?cid=1&pid=2

[petek]

Originally Posted by DeepWater

do you have any opinions on the JET line of these benchtop mill/drills and lathes. Are they good quality or in the cheap knock-off category?

I can't speak for their metal working tools, but I have their JWBS-14MW 14 in wood/metal (3-speed) bandsaw and am quite satisfied with the quality of the machine. It compares well with the better Delta machines. The castings are solid and true, and the adjustments are easy to use and stay set pretty well. The included accessories (fence, square) are cheap, though.

[Tatsu]

Our team went through this with $4000. we ended up buying a bridgeport.. but here are the other options we considered

1. Sieg X2 http://www.grizzly.com/products/G8689
2. Sieg X3 http://www.grizzly.com/products/G0463
3. ZAY http://www.lathemaster.com/HEAVYDUTY...E%207045FG.htm
4. IH Mill. http://www.industrialhobbies.com/
5. Used bridgeport www.craigslist.com

We went with 5, why? we found a great deal for a very un-worn bridgeport (nearly pristine) with a good DRO, power feed, full set of precision collets. With a vari-speed head.
IMO the X2 has serious rigidity issues, but its good for whatever work FIRST requires (+-2~3 mil) and you can take it to regionals (reasonably)
X3 is much better, more rigid, and people have supposedly held mil tolerance.. so I guess its pretty good there
the ZAY and IH are by the same manufacturer, the IH is just HUGE and has hardened gears, as well as a CNC option. the free shipping also makes it worth it... we were about to go with the IH mill when we found the bridgeport deal.

Honestly, just pick a dovetail column mill, its more rigid, doesnt need re-center every time z is changed... or a knee mill (better, but more expensive).

Also, I'm not sure if used equipment is the best way to go.. fixing the machine can be as much of a challenge in and of itself..

Tatsu