Defense: Pushing and Blocking

[d.courtney]

It seems that many teams (from the teasers they have released) have been sacrificing defensive measures for having a better shooting robot... which then lies my question... do you see your team as a defencive asset and if so, how many robots would you hazard to guess that you could push at once, as pushing robots around is the easiest type of defence. Last years robot we had was pushing 3 robots at once in Waterloo, and this years can out push our last years robot by a long shot. And secondly how well do you think your robot will block?

[vadyr]

im no in manufacturing, so i cant speak for them..but im a potenial driver, and from driving this thing i know that its really solid and when u want to u can stop anything with it. i know it doesnt have an obvious defensive system, but i gues you could say being a strong and solid robot is a system in its own

[DjAlamose]

We have sacrificed some defensive measures on our robot for a more offensive robot. But we still have our counter measures for being pushed around. We don’t want to burn down our battery by trying to push a robot and then try to shoot at the same time. That would be bad. So we came up with a few ways of preventing that. AND PLEASE remember not to be un GP and ram your robot into others. Yes it’s against the rules but it still happens and isn't always called. We had big problems with teams ramming into us last year. But we have found our own little ways of stopping the unstoppable.

[vadyr]

Originally Posted by DjAlamose

We have sacrificed some defensive measures on our robot for a more offensive robot. But we still have our counter measures for being pushed around. We don’t want to burn down our battery by trying to push a robot and then try to shoot at the same time. That would be bad. So we came up with a few ways of preventing that. AND PLEASE remember not to be un GP and ram your robot into others. Yes it’s against the rules but it still happens and isn't always called. We had big problems with teams ramming into us last year. But we have found our own little ways of stopping the unstoppable.

yea ramming was a problem last year...at nationals we were pinned against the wall and being rammed repeatedly and it wasnt called. we finally faked him and got out of there, but there was some damage as a result of it

[Daniel_LaFleur]

If we play defense, it will be pushing. Most targeting systems wont be able to shoot accurately if thier platform (IE the robot) is being pushed or disturbed while shooting. So they will have to try to get a clear shot, stop to shoot. We may not have the most fancy drive system (matter of fact, its kinda plain) but we will push around most bots this year, especially those holonomic jobbers

[sanddrag]

we have sacrificed some traction for driveability. we will still have a 4 motor 6wd 2 speed drive system though

[Pavan Dave]

Defence???? Who needs defence with an awesome offence??

LoL...

I think that we will end up just being the tall guy standing in front of you bumping for defence

-Pavan

[Josh Murphy]

our robot can play defense if needed and offense if needed so we are potentially a balanced machine but we are leaning more towards one of the two so time will tell.

[Shu Song]

Any robot can play a very good defense, even if it doesn't have "defensive measures". Short range pushing has always been allowed by FIRST and that's all you need to get a shooting robot of target. The robot that can plant itself somewhere and can't be moved will have the easiest time at shooting balls in.

Ideally, the best robot would be one that can shoot on the move, its barrel aimed at the goal all the time and adjusted for movement. But due to the not so accurate nature of the camera, this type of tracking system would be incredibly hard to implement. (if a team has achieved this, I appologize for underestimating)

So really, any robot that can move can play defense just as good as any other. Lots of pushing power isn't necessarily important, because all that is required for a robot to miss is a little nudge while shooting. Granted that great pushing power is never bad thing, it's (IMO) not a very integral part of this year's defense on robots.

[artdutra04]

This year's game will be a very dynamic one, in which the strategies that you start with will not necessarily be the ones you stick with. Because there are so many different ideas on the best way to actually win, and/or prevent the other alliance from winning, we will see some very interesting strategy this year.

For the past two years, my team has always focused on solid offense. As great as a good defense is, if you can put up six tetras per match, or score twenty poof balls into the center goal in ten seconds, you are at a much better advantage. I love amazing offensive dominations; as the amount of creative engineering and design and thought that goes into them is unbelievable. After all, why are teams like 71 and 111 held in such high regard among the FIRST community?

Defense wins matches. Offense wins competitions.

[pyroslev]

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...8&postcount=41

This was a nutty idea had in the beginning. Longshot at best as stated but a dumbed down version could easily be at home an alliance with 2 Mass Shooters.

[rocknthehawk]

Last year our team perfected the art of being defensive, while still scoring major points. This year our robot is more of a tank and should have twice the torque of last year, so we'll have plenty of pushing power if need be, and the capability of holding around 50 or so balls, so score a few easy points, then push some guys around.

I'm still pushing for the pneumatic lift system. Basically like a car with an air-ride or hydraulic suspension. Build the drivetrain on a small frame, and build the rest of the robot on a seperate frame, over the drivetrain frame, supported by pneumatic cylinders. when you get where you want to be and aim, let the air out of the pneumatics, and set the actual frame down on the ground and pull the wheels off the ground. just be sure not to have the edges tear up the carpet. with all the weight, it would probably be pretty tough to push it a little. I want to build something like this in the offseason this year.


ohhohh i remember i had a picture of a chevy s-10 doing this, on air ride suspension, mono-leafed in the rear. It lays frame an pulls the wheels off the ground. i'll try and post it later tonight or tommorow...i have to find it....

[greencactus3]

oh man, a robot that lays frame. us minitruckers will LOVE to see this. a couple titanium dragblocks and then you'd have a LOT of fun at night too.
monoleafed air ride is bad. nice 5links and stuff is mucho better for the truck.
for pics of s10s dragging and laying just browse the s10forum.com

Our defense is simply pushing. With our wheels, and our 2 speed, we can race up to an opponent, and push just about anyone across the whole field. If somone is out of range, they can't score, correct?

[Nuttyman54]

Where's the "We could go either way" option?

we have a multi-speed transmission, and should be able to push fairly easily. I've noticed a number of robots using casters, holonomic or omni wheels, which could prove very easy to push. We intend to test different strategies and go with what works best.