CNN: Why do Girls Lose Interest in Math and Science?

[Beth Sweet]

I'm not sure that I entirely buy that girls aren't going into science because their mom's are proud that they can't balance their checkbooks. I think that the problem lies a bit deeper: the self esteem/confidence (or lack thereof) of todays girls.

Yes there is a nerd stigma associated with science. But some of the most popular girls from my high school are now majoring in engineering. So I look further at those girls and notice something about them. They are strong and confident. They are not affected by the nerd stigma because they don't allow themselves to be.

My thoughts on how to fix it? Try to fix the confidence factor. It is the one part of this that we can control. We cannot control how their peers treat girls, but if we make our girls as self confident as they can be, then I think that there will be more of them going into science without fear of being "nerds".

[Bridgette]

For the most part, I have been supported in my math and science related endeavors. My parents encouraged my involvement in FLL in middle school. My participation in FLL actually led me to intern for the Navy during the summer before my freshman year of high school! That internship, as well as mentorship from my FLL mentors even after I was finished with the program helped me to keep an interest in math and science as I entered high school.

Without FLL or my older brother's FIRST participation, I don't think I would have discovered my interest in engineering. In fact, due to some conflicts during my freshmen year, I wasn't involved on 121. During my sophomore year, I became a member of 121. I did a great deal of the electrical work on the robot and I also wrote the team's chairman's award submission. I felt that I had to step up to escape from my brother's shadow and prove myself as a contributing member of the team. While my team has been great to me (and I will miss them as I start college in the fall), I still feel that I'm not taken as seriously because of my gender.

Also, some people seem to believe that women in math and science receive preferential treatment because they are in the minority. I have not found this to be true. I agree with Beth about confidence being a major issue. There have been times when I wanted to give up on pursuing a career in engineering. I have had some difficulty with my math and science classes this year (my final year of high school), but it has just made me work harder. I like a challenge, and I like proving people wrong. I know that I want to be an engineer, and I am not letting anyone stop me from achieving my dreams.

So what can be done to keep girls interested? Providing female role models is crucial, but I think career education is important as well. Let young students learn about the many different jobs available for people with degrees in math and science. I don’t feel like forcing girls into math and science will solve the problem, but making the topics more accessible could help. The “glass ceiling” still exists today, and it takes a lot of strength, diligence, and perseverance for women to be treated equally.

[Elgin Clock]

Originally Posted by Bridgette

Without FLL or my older brother's FIRST participation, I don't think I would have discovered my interest in engineering. .... I felt that I had to step up to escape from my brother's shadow and prove myself as a contributing member of the team. While my team has been great to me (and I will miss them as I start college in the fall), I still feel that I'm not taken as seriously because of my gender.

As an older brother of both a sister and a brother who are about to enter HS in the next year, and year after respectively, I can see the impact I have on their lives, and quite frankly it scares me sometimes.

As my sister is moving from 8th grade to freshman status in HS next year, she has already shown an interest in joining "her big bro's team".

Whether it is just because I am on it, or it's because she wants to really know about robotics and engineering still has yet to be seen.

I'm hoping (for my ego's sake at this point) it's because of me , but that in 4 years from now when she is a senior or graduated HS, that it will have progressed more than just a way to hang out with her older Brother more, and that she will truly be inspired by the program and take something from it.

I don't even care if its engineering related. (I know blasphemy you say!) lol But, being on a FIRST team is about learning not only about engineering and technology, and whether you want to be a part of that world after HS, but also learning about yourself and what kind of person you want to be when you grow up.

Would I love to see both my Sister and Brother become something related to an engineering field when they grow up?? Sure.

Will I be disappointed and angry at FIRST or the program and think it has not done its job if they don't go into an engineering related field?? Nope.

All I want them to do is be on the team and just open themselves up to the possibility of pursuing a career in Engineering. If it's just not their cup of tea so to speak, that's fine with me. But I will support both of them, my Sister and my Brother in whatever they decide to do with their lives.

I think that's what it all comes down to. You don't necessarily need to pursue engineering and technology as a field of study and career, but just be aware that it's out there and there are things to do in the field if you want to. And giving some sometimes biased support towards engineering, but letting them decide their future, no matter what it may be, for themselves, is the way I'll approach this.

Nobody should be limited in the types of career they choose, whether it be engineering, marketing, accounting, medicine, or any other technical, or non-technical related field.

Originally Posted by Rick TYler

Statistically speaking, most people are dumber than you. That's why you need to excel -- to take care of them.

I don't know what to think of that. Part of me is cracking up, and part of me is saddened by the fact that that may be true.

[Cynette]

Are girls really losing interest in Science and Math in HS, or are they just pursuing other interests which may make them more well-rounded than their male counterparts? The article only gives two statistics to show the disparity, the ratios in AP Physics and the number of women enrolled in engineering.

But without viewing the statistics behind the news release we don't have the whole story.

What percent of girls take AP classes in total?

What percent take any AP science (Bio, Chem, Earth Sci...)

Does a girl who takes AP English, French and Chemistry dislike science and math more than a boy who takes AP Physics, Statistics and Am. History? Or has she run out of room in her schedule trying to spread her interests out?

How about career selection... what other careers were counted as Science loving careers, or Math loving careers? Do biologists count? Doctors? Pharmacists? Accountants? Business Majors?

Maybe the problem is with the appeal to AP Physics and engineering.

Time out for a caveat...
(I am an engineer. I love science and math and many moons ago I was coerced (talked into) into engineering by a guidance counselor. And while I love being an engineer and sailed through my undergraduate and graduate degrees with a maximum of 20% women in any class, I have discovered that when I grow up, I think I want to be a teacher. Yeah - I'd probably teach science or math. Would that mean I loved science and math less had I become a teacher? I don't think so. )

Back to my initial train of thought...

I have a daughter who is a Junior in HS. Does she like science and math? Not as much as English and Social Studies. But she is taking AP Physics and AP Calculus. Does she like either one of those classes? Not really. Is that my fault or her guidance counselors fault? No. It really is that she has discovered that there are many other things that seem more fun to her.

As a matter of fact she wasn't going to take physics at all, to make room for other classes - like AP Biology and AP Chemistry. See, she doesn't want to be an engineer, she wants to be a doctor. She thought that doctors didn't need to take physics. But when we went through the college catalogs for pre-med, almost all of them said she would need to complete two semesters of physics, so she decided to give it a go. Maybe the schools just do a bad job of explaining what physics is? (I remember not liking physics much when I was in HS either, but it was a tracked science so all college prep students took it. Oops, I digressed again) Maybe HS's give the smart girls too many other classes to choose from, and AP Physisc has the least appeal.

Of her group of AP Physics, Calculus taking, and so on girlfriends - none of them want to be engineers either. But there are 3 doctors, two pharmacists, two biologists, and other assorted careers, none of which should be considered "domestic."

Maybe a new study need to be done... why do girls not choose engineering if they are good at science and math?

Cynette

[Eugenia Gabrielov]

Will you be telling me I am not enough of a scientist when I am getting rid of your tumor? Or your child's? I hope not.

[Cynette]

Originally Posted by Eugenia Gabrielov
Will you be telling me I am not enough of a scientist when I am getting rid of your tumor? Or your child's? I hope not.

Wow! It only took you 25 words to say what it took me 400 words to try to explain!

[AJunx]

Hello All,

Today, I gave Secretary Spellings' office a call to ask some questions and bring up the topic of FIRST.

The person I spoke with was helpful, he instructed me to write a letter to Secretary Spellings so as to ensure that I would receive a response. I will be writing a letter addressed to Ms Spellings tomorrow, but you know what? I don't think one letter is quite enough.

This is the deal, Dean gave us homework, and here is a great opportunity to get the Secretary of the Department of Education on the FIRST bandwagon. I shall request that everyone, and particularly the girls participating on FIRST teams, do the following:

1) Call Secretary Spellings' Office at (202) 401-3000. When someone picks up, say something like this:

"Hello, my name is __________, and I would like to speak to Secretary Spellings regarding her recent comments on girls losing interest in math and science. I take part in FIRST robotics and I want to impress upon the secretary what a great tool it is for getting girls [and boys too] interested in math and science. I also want to know what the Secretary is doing in the way of supporting FIRST robotics.

2) When the person on the other end suggests that you write a letter, write a letter, it will cost you less than a dollar (or you can fax it) and it could result in increased support of FIRST by the Department of Education. In your letter, tell the Secretary how important FIRST is and tell her about your experience.

3) E-mail Secretary Spellings and make sure "F.I.R.S.T. Robotics" is in the title.


Secretary Margaret Spellings contact info:

+ phone: (202) 401-3000
+ fax: (202) 401-0596 (fax your letter if you can)

+ e-mail: Margaret.Spellings@ed.gov
(e-mail a copy to her secretary @ Christina.Wilson@ed.gov)

+ mailing address: 400 Maryland Avenue, SW, Washington, DC 20202


-Andrew

[Robyn Needel]

Part of giving girls self-confidence has to come from their role models (both women and men!) telling the girls that boyfriends are great but shouldn't influence their life decisions. I know too many girls who choose to act dumb so that boys will like them and it gets me really frustrated. We need to let girls know that they should feel comfortable in their own choices, that worthwhile boyfriends and partners should be supportive in their lives, not put them down for following their dreams.

I plan to write to Secretary Spellman tomorrow and explain that I mentor some wonderful girls who are choosing to pursue science and technology careers as a result of their involvement in FIRST - I think it's a great idea if everyone on Chief Delphi writes in to talk about how FIRST is changing the culture of women in our world today.

Robyn

[Pat Chen]

[quote=Elgin Clock]

As an older brother of both a sister and a brother who are about to enter HS in the next year, and year after respectively, I can see the impact I have on their lives, and quite frankly it scares me sometimes.
..........................
Whether it is just because I am on it, or it's because she wants to really know about robotics and engineering still has yet to be seen.

I'm hoping (for my ego's sake at this point)

As an older brother...you do wield some influence on your younger siblings.....Congratulations on being such a terrific brother that your sister wants to join the team.


I am a math teacher in a middle school.....when I meet parents.....most of the time....the first thing I am told is.."I was lousy at math so don't expect my child to be any good' or " I don't where he or she gets it from since I was not a good math student".......

I will have to agree with some of the postings that many teachers do not encourage girls to pursue math or sciences (nor do they verbally discourage them either)......girls tend to be stereotyped as having good verbal linguistics skills versus mathematical logical skills....I believed that this is not intentional but reverting to stereotyping.....

unfortunately.....many of our students are trained to "whine" and "beg" for retakes of exams or extra credits to improve one's grades...... parents put the pressure on the students to get all "A's"......so as a teacher......if there is a subgroup does most of the whining and begging......you are happy when no one from that particular group is missing from your roster......

This doesn't mean that we cannot change the current culture....Yes we can.... and the RCU is trying to do just that.

[TimCraig]

And maybe it would be pertinent to ask why you abandoned technology and selected your major at the university with the not quite largest student population in the US?

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by Beth Sweet

I'm not sure that I entirely buy that girls aren't going into science because their mom's are proud that they can't balance their checkbooks. I think that the problem lies a bit deeper: the self esteem/confidence (or lack thereof) of todays girls.

Yes there is a nerd stigma associated with science. But some of the most popular girls from my high school are now majoring in engineering. So I look further at those girls and notice something about them. They are strong and confident. They are not affected by the nerd stigma because they don't allow themselves to be.

My thoughts on how to fix it? Try to fix the confidence factor. It is the one part of this that we can control. We cannot control how their peers treat girls, but if we make our girls as self confident as they can be, then I think that there will be more of them going into science without fear of being "nerds".

My father would have had no understanding how to mentor or counsel me in a college career much less science or engineering. He died thinking I would graduate from high school and get married. I went to college with my mother's support though she had no clear vision of why. Teachers, mentors, engineers, parents have all grown along with the dreams and aspirations of women up through the 2000's.

It is my thinking that the individual should take responsibility for communicating to her support sytem: mentors, engineers, parents, what they have been doing right and what they could do to increase their understanding of the woman's journey in achieving success in these fields of science and engineering. That will help future students and team members.

Also, the pool of support from young women as alums, successful college graduates and mentors is growing. Sally Ride says role models are needed - that's you. That's what you've been doing and will continue to do for years to come, each year being joined by more.

[Evenstar_342]

I totally agree that self-confidence is one of the most important things for a girl to have. Since engineering and the sciences have a reputation for being "difficult for women", having the self confidence can do wonders in encouraging women to pursue these fields. Self-confidence helps even if you're not going to be an engineer. You'll always run into daunting problems in any field.

I've been extremely lucky in having parents that are very supportive of my interests in engineering. This, along with exposure to FLL at a young age, helped me decide to become an engineer. I think that role models whether they be parents, coaches or simply visible engineers and scientists like Sally Ride are crucial in instilling self confidence and interest in engineering and science in young women.