The "What the!?!?!" Rule Thread

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Jack Jones

"What the!?!?!"


English!?!?!

It was English. IF a COTS is designed specifically for FIRST (not likely to be available to other robot comps or outsiders is how I see that), it will invite inspection. And, please consider the rest of that rule. IF it is just "plug and play" with little or no assembly or design work, it will not play. If it could be used in multiple places (e.g. AndyMark trannies), it will be allowed. For the record, here is the full text of that paragraph:

Originally Posted by Manual 8.3.4.2

However, COTS items that have been specifically designed are in and of themselves as a solution to portion of the FIRST Robotics Competition challenge may or may not fit within the FRC intent,and must be carefully considered. If the item provides general functionality that can be utilized in any of several possible configurations or applications, then it is acceptable (as the teams will still have to design their particular application of the item). However, COTS items that provide a complete “pre-packaged” solution for a major ROBOT function (e.g. a complete manipulator assembly, pre-built pneumatics circuit, or full mobility system) that require no effort other than just bolting it on to the ROBOT are against the intent of the competition, and will not be permitted.

[Nick 568]

One new rule I find interesting is the "your pit cannot be taller than 10 feet" rule.... Why you ask?
Well, last year, when I lived in the DC area, I was on team 1885. At the championship, we had a 42" plasma mounted about 9' off the ground, so it was over definitely above 10' total height, lol.




Is anyone else having problems with their sevaa server? Our mysql isn't working, so our forums and cpanel aren't accessible. I believe they were attacked or something because their support forums are filled with nothing but spam.

[JohnBoucher]

<G29> ROBOT orientation - ROBOTS must start the match with their long (maximum) dimension in a vertical orientation.

[Travis Hoffman]

Originally Posted by JohnBoucher

<G29> ROBOT orientation - ROBOTS must start the match with their long (maximum) dimension in a vertical orientation.

I bet 67 is happy - flop-bots are back in style. There's another team that could use their '04-'05 design in this year's game with little modification. Heck, they even already have a ramp on their backs (although I imagine a little reinforcement would be in order).....

[Taylor]

The part I found interesting is that there is a 10 point penalty for scoring for the other alliance, yet qual points are awarded based on the losing team's score. I wonder how many times, for example, the Redabots will be winning by 60 (which, given the exponential structure of the scoring, is by no means out of the question!) and score for the Blueabots, taking the 10-pointer but still winning the match.

[efoote868]

Originally Posted by Nick 568

One new rule I find interesting is the "your pit cannot be taller than 10 feet" rule.... Why you ask?
Well, last year, when I lived in the DC area, I was on team 1885. At the championship, we had a 42" plasma mounted about 9' off the ground, so it was over definitely above 10' total height, lol.

uh, that rule actually isn't new. There was an update last year (about midway through the season) that said no pit displays were to be taller than 10 feet. No one really followed it, and the mentor in charge of the display was really angry whenever he saw something "soaring" into the air...

He was also joking with me about it this year:

If your robot has unfolded to more than 10 feet tall during the match, and it goes into your pit, is that a violation?

[smurfgirl]

7.3.6
<G56> ROBOTS in HOME ZONE - ROBOTS score bonus points at the end of the match if they are entirely in their HOME ZONE, not in contact with any element of the field (carpet, alliance station, goal etc.) and the lowest point of the ROBOT is higher than 4 and/or 10 inches above the carpeted field surface/ The number of bonus points an ALLIANCE receives is based on the total number of ROBOTS satisfying these conditions. Each ALLIANCE ROBOT entirely in their HOME ZONE at the end of the match is eligible to receive the following bonus points:
- Each ROBOT between 0 and 3.9 inches above floor level- 0 bonus points
- Each ROBOT between 4.0 and 11.9 inches above floor level- 15 bonus points
- Each ROBOT 12.0 inches or more above floor level- 30 bonus points



I know they referred to 12" everywhere else, so is the 10" just a typo?



Also:

7.2.3.2
<G07>The RACK will be moved (translated and/or rotated) to an arbitrary position so that the center of the RACK is within a 3 foot radius of the playing field center but the exact location and orientation of the RACK is unpredictable. After this point in time no ROBOT may be moved or repositioned until the match starts.



Wouldn't this mean one alliance could have an unfair playing advantage if the rack is shifted 3 feet towards the opposite end of the field (the end where they pick up their game pieces)?

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by smurfgirl

Wouldn't this mean one alliance could have an unfair playing advantage if the rack is shifted 3 feet towards the opposite end of the field (the end where they pick up their game pieces)?

Not especially--if they're not planning on it being three feet closer, they're gonna have a rude awakening.

In theory, with the sensor capabilities we have this year, the extra three feet should be negligible to getting the robot to score the keepers.

[AndyB]

I find it a bit disappointing that you can only really put one ring on a spider leg. I liked the format in 05' where you could keep stacking your tetras, i guess with this setup, it relies on more quick thinking as you only have 2 spoilers to your disposal, but still, it would have been interesting.

[Xufer]

RULE <R46> The last line says "Electric Solenoid actuators are prohibited from use" to that I say WHAT THE !?!?! its another added annoyance to overcome this year, its not a big deal but solenoids where always a nice component to fall back on... not this year! I'd imagine it s for safety reasons because I always foresaw an issue with a solenoid over heating and burning a person who did not know it was hot.

[jgannon]

Originally Posted by Xufer

RULE <R46> The last line says "Electric Solenoid actuators are prohibited from use" to that I say WHAT THE !?!?! its another added annoyance to overcome this year, its not a big deal but solenoids where always a nice component to fall back on... not this year! I'd imagine it s for safety reasons because I always foresaw an issue with a solenoid over heating and burning a person who did not know it was hot.

This rule has existed since at least 2004 (though I would guess it's been around forever). I think it's probably more of an issue for maintaining equal maximum power between teams, rather than a safety issue.

[Xufer]

Are you sure i remember using them in 04 but i know i havent used them in the past 2 years. its possible i never notivced because i never thought to use them those years.

[petek]

Originally Posted by T. Hoffman

I bet 67 is happy - flop-bots are back in style. There's another team that could use their '04-'05 design in this year's game with little modification. Heck, they even already have a ramp on their backs (although I imagine a little reinforcement would be in order).....

I expect some clarification on this rule. As I read it, <G29> would mean that a basic Class 1 low-profile KOP robot (e.g. a rookie team boxbot) that is 28w x 38l x 18h in its normal running configuration would have to start the match standing on end and would have to flop to run.

[Nick 568]

Originally Posted by efoote868

uh, that rule actually isn't new. There was an update last year (about midway through the season) that said no pit displays were to be taller than 10 feet. No one really followed it, and the mentor in charge of the display was really angry whenever he saw something "soaring" into the air...

He was also joking with me about it this year:

Oh, ok, I was under the impression this was a new rule since no one at the championship seemed to follow it...we only got complaints about our display sticking out from the pit area some, but not the height.

[NiGhtMarE_AnGeL]

Im stoked about having the idea of the "tic tack toe" style again like from tripple play, only extended.

And it was said earlier in the thread that if you had a bot from that year (tripple play) you could modify it and see if the same idea works for this year. Its funny because we were sitting in our chairs, the 4 of us mentor girls from the years before saying that!..only, we pretty much tore it apart to use it for LAST years game... lol

im just wondering how many more intertubes we are going to deflate in accordance to how many tetras we broke. (which unlike the tetras, can still be scored! )

This is me, being stoked